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Alternatives for ground (for PC's)

 
 
Skybuck Flying
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      09-07-2011, 09:33 PM
Hello,

I am starting to suspect "ground" for PC's does more damage than good.

Perhaps the "ground" leads to a "backdoor" for electricity to do damage.

Therefore instead of dumping energy into the ground wire an alternative
could be found.

For example some kind of circuit which transfer the energy into heat.

So that the energy is dumped into the system's air.

This way PC's no longer require a "ground" and there is no longer a
"backdoor" for damage.

Bye,
Skybuck.
 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-07-2011, 09:34 PM
This alternative would be especially usefull for environments which don't
have a ground.

Like my living room or perhaps international space station ?

Does ISS have a ground ?

How about laptops ? Do they have a ground when not plugged in ?

How about iPads or iPhones ?

Bye,
Skybuck =D

 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-07-2011, 10:05 PM
Oh really,

Sounds like you making a joke ?!

But just in case your are not, provide some proof/documentation of these
"facts" !

It does raise the interesting question, why PC's need ground and everything
else does not.

I was thinking maybe the excessive stuff is stored inside and later
dispossed when charging.

But what if a device would not need any charging for a long time ?

Bye,
Skybuck.


 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-07-2011, 10:07 PM
In case you are making a joke I will add to it:

"It is not disposed it is exploded into your head when the battery
explodes".

Bye,
Skybuck.

"Mark Thorson" wrote in message news:(E-Mail Removed)...

Skybuck Flying wrote:
>
> How about laptops ? Do they have a ground when not plugged in ?


They use the human body. The ground is that
warm spot on the bottom.

> How about iPads or iPhones ?


The ground is in the earpiece. Excess electricity
is passed into your head.

 
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Mark Thorson
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      09-07-2011, 10:57 PM
Skybuck Flying wrote:
>
> How about laptops ? Do they have a ground when not plugged in ?


They use the human body. The ground is that
warm spot on the bottom.

> How about iPads or iPhones ?


The ground is in the earpiece. Excess electricity
is passed into your head.
 
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Dave Platt
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      09-08-2011, 12:42 AM
In article <372b9$4e67eabc$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.ho me.nl>,
Skybuck Flying <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>It does raise the interesting question, why PC's need ground and everything
>else does not.


Your assumption ("everything else does not") is false.

Many other sorts of device do (for legal and safety reasons) require a
ground connection. Here in the U.S., most major appliances do require
three-wire grounded power cords.

Here's the short version, as it applies to power-mains circuitry in
the United States. Details may differ for mains connection rules in
other countries.

An appliance generally requires a safety-ground connection, if it has
a metal chassis or other electrically-conductive exterior, which can
be touched by a human. This chassis is required to be connected to a
safety ground - one which returns to the ground connection at the
power distribution panel, and which does not carry any portion of the
normal load-return current.

This safety grounding of the chassis is intended to protect humans
against shock, if an electrical fault develops inside the device (e.g.
a loose wire) that could create an electrical connection between the
power wiring and the chassis.

Without a safety ground to the chassis, this sort of fault will result
in a "hot" chassis. If a person were to touch the chassis, at the
same time that they were touching a grounded object (or standing in
water, or etc.), their body would complete the circuit and AC power
would flow through their body. The amount of current needed to kill a
person is *far* too small to blow a fuse, and thus the person could die.

Grounding the chassis prevents this. If a "weak" connection between
the power wiring and the chassis occurs (e.g. low-level leakage), the
safety ground will hold the chassis very near to the ground voltage
level, reducing the risk of electrical shock by quite a lot. If a
real short-circuit to the chassis occurs, the grounding of the chassis
will either cause the fuse to blow, or will result in a loud
SPLUT-BANG! which will vaporize the shorting wire, or both.

Appliance do not require a safety ground if they're designed in a way
which prevents an internal fault from creating a hot chassis. One way
is often referred to as a "double-insulated" design... the wires
themselves are insulated, and the device's outer shell consists only
of nonconductive (insulated) materials.

In the U.S., you can also do away with the need for a safety ground
(in some cases) by using a "ground-fault interruptor" - a device which
detects the fact that "current is flowing where it should not" and
disconnects the power before injury can occur.

Desktop and server PCs usually require safety grounds because they are
not double-insulated... they have exposed metal on their backplanes
(and often the case is metal) and their internal power supplies have
metal cases which are connected directly to the outer case.

Laptop PCs can sometimes operate without a safety ground, because they
have nonconductive (plastic) cases, and because the power entering the
PC is at a low enough voltage that it does not create a significant
shock hazard.

--
Dave Platt <(E-Mail Removed)> AE6EO
Friends of Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior
I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will
boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!
 
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Robert Wessel
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      09-08-2011, 01:15 AM
On Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:42:01 -0700, (E-Mail Removed) (Dave Platt)
wrote:

>Laptop PCs can sometimes operate without a safety ground, because they
>have nonconductive (plastic) cases, and because the power entering the
>PC is at a low enough voltage that it does not create a significant
>shock hazard.



Below certain power levels, gadgets powered by an appropriately
designed wallwart are exempt from grounding, since the wallwart
provides the required isolation.
 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-08-2011, 03:33 AM


"Dave Platt" wrote in message news(E-Mail Removed)...

In article <372b9$4e67eabc$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.ho me.nl>,
Skybuck Flying <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>It does raise the interesting question, why PC's need ground and everything
>else does not.


"
Your assumption ("everything else does not") is false.
"

My assumption is true.

Everything should work without ground because not everything has grounding
power wall sockets.

End of story.

Bye,
Skybuck.



 
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Joe Pfeiffer
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      09-08-2011, 04:20 AM
"Skybuck Flying" <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> "Dave Platt" wrote in message news(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> In article <372b9$4e67eabc$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.ho me.nl>,
> Skybuck Flying <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>It does raise the interesting question, why PC's need ground and everything
>>else does not.

>
> "
> Your assumption ("everything else does not") is false.
> "
>
> My assumption is true.
>
> Everything should work without ground because not everything has
> grounding power wall sockets.
>
> End of story.


I don't suppose there is any remote possibility you might consider
actually spending five minutes learning the faintest smidgeon about the
topics you post on before you post? Or at least quit using new accounts
so you'll quit escaping my killfiles?

Didn't think so.
 
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Dave Platt
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      09-08-2011, 05:32 AM
In article <276a6$4e683768$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.ho me.nl>,
Skybuck Flying <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>>It does raise the interesting question, why PC's need ground and everything
>>else does not.

>
>"
>Your assumption ("everything else does not") is false.
>"
>
>My assumption is true.
>
>Everything should work without ground because not everything has grounding
>power wall sockets.
>
>End of story.


Not quite - at least, not if you want a full answer.

The answer is this: almost all such devices will "work" without a
ground. You could cut off the ground prong of the power cord, plug
the remaining two prongs into a non-grounding power wall socket, and
the device would "work". It would run.

However, it would not work *SAFELY* - at least, not in a legal sense.
The device (PC, refrigerator, power tool, etc.) would have lost one of
its designed-in safety features - that of a safe grounding of the
chassis.

If such a device were to develop an internal short circuit when it
still had a ground, it would probably blow a fuse or trip a circuit
breaker... annoying perhaps, but it would "fail safe".

If you cut off or otherwise disable the ground prong on the plug, and
the device develops an internal short circuit... the next time you
touch it you can get a very severe shock and die. The device will not
"fail safe".

So, the device will still "work" without a ground... but what it
"works on" may be the job of getting ready to kill you.

This is why you really should not try to run your PC without a ground.
It might have a grudge, and decide to electrocute you if given the
opportunity.

--
Dave Platt <(E-Mail Removed)> AE6EO
Friends of Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior
I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will
boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!
 
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