AMD Sempron Socket A -- overheat protection?

I recently bought an AMD Sempron 3000+ (Socket A, Barton core, 512K L2
cache) with PC Chips M825g mobo and noticed that this mobo's BIOS
doesn't have a setting for enabling any CPU overheat protection
shutdown.

1. Does the PC Chips M825g mobo have built-in CPU overheat protection?

2. Does the Socket A Sempron 3000+ have built-in CPU overheat
protection as the Athlon64 CPUs do?

I realize that I can use MBM5 to shut down the computer in case it
overheats, but I prefer protection that works even if Windows locks up.
On my Duron CPU computer I have a hardware device to shut off the
computer when the CPU gets too hot.

On 13 Jun 2005 12:30:22 -0700, "larry moe 'n curly"
<> wrote:

>I recently bought an AMD Sempron 3000+ (Socket A, Barton core, 512K L2
>cache) with PC Chips M825g mobo and noticed that this mobo's BIOS
>doesn't have a setting for enabling any CPU overheat protection
>shutdown.
>
>1. Does the PC Chips M825g mobo have built-in CPU overheat protection?

It's supposed to, as are all boards adhering to AMD's spec
for Socket A after (a certain point in time, about 3 years
ago, IIRC). I can't confirm that it does though, and
suggest you look again at the bios pages and motherboard
manual.


>
>2. Does the Socket A Sempron 3000+ have built-in CPU overheat
>protection as the Athlon64 CPUs do?

No, it has a thermal diode to take temp readings, that is
all. The actual shutdown mechanism (threshold) is then
left with user options and implemented by the motherboard.



>
>I realize that I can use MBM5 to shut down the computer in case it
>overheats, but I prefer protection that works even if Windows locks up.
> On my Duron CPU computer I have a hardware device to shut off the
>computer when the CPU gets too hot.

I would be more concerned about proper cooling subsystem
design and good fan selection. It is rare for good, low RPM
fans to die. Don't use cheap, off-brand (meaning anything
not bearing a _fan_ manufacturer's label, not a 3rd party
label like Coolermaster or Antec or ???. While those two
and others do sell some products with decent fans, you don't
have an assurance of the actual fan they relabeled in all
cases (situations). Instead trust Nidec, NMB, Papst,
Panaflo, Sanyo, Delta, et al.

kony wrote:
> On 13 Jun 2005 12:30:22 -0700, "larry moe 'n curly"
> <> wrote:

> >1. Does the PC Chips M825g mobo have built-in CPU overheat
> >protection?
>
> It's supposed to, as are all boards adhering to AMD's spec
> for Socket A after (a certain point in time, about 3 years
> ago, IIRC). I can't confirm that it does though, and
> suggest you look again at the bios pages and motherboard
> manual.

Neither the manual nor the new BIOS (May 2005, replacing July 2004)
mention anything about CPU thermal protection, and it wouldn't surprise
me if this mobo didn't follow AMD specs because I found that all the
fuses for the keyboard, mouse, and USB ports were replaced with jumper
wires.

> >2. Does the Socket A Sempron 3000+ have built-in CPU overheat
> >protection as the Athlon64 CPUs do?
>
> No, it has a thermal diode to take temp readings, that is
> all. The actual shutdown mechanism (threshold) is then
> left with user options and implemented by the motherboard.

> >I can use MBM5 to shut down the computer in case it
> >overheats, but I prefer protection that works even if
> >Windows locks up.

> I would be more concerned about proper cooling subsystem
> design and good fan selection. It is rare for good, low RPM
> fans to die. Don't use cheap, off-brand (meaning anything
> not bearing a _fan_ manufacturer's label, not a 3rd party
> label like Coolermaster or Antec or ???. While those two
> and others do sell some products with decent fans, you don't
> have an assurance of the actual fan they relabeled in all
> cases (situations). Instead trust Nidec, NMB, Papst,
> Panaflo, Sanyo, Delta, et al.

Oddly, the only CPU fans to give me trouble were all Deltas provided
with retail boxed AMD CPUs. Years ago, five K6-2 CPUs fans squealed
loudly beause their rear sleeve bearings hadn't been lubed at the
factory. Every Delta fan vibrated, and the one included with my Athlon
XP1800+ was so bad that I asked AMD replaced it, but the replacement
vibrated the same. OTOH the same heatsink sold by Coolermaster with a
Coolermaster-labelled fan was buzz-free. I was also happy that this
Sempron 3000+ came with a smooth-running fan, labelled AVS.

I use an overtemperature shutoff device consisting of a quad comparator
and some thermistors and have it monitor the CPU, graphics chip, and
hard drives.

On 14 Jun 2005 00:09:51 -0700, "larry moe 'n curly"
<> wrote:

>kony wrote:
>> On 13 Jun 2005 12:30:22 -0700, "larry moe 'n curly"
>> <> wrote:
>
>> >1. Does the PC Chips M825g mobo have built-in CPU overheat
>> >protection?
>>
>> It's supposed to, as are all boards adhering to AMD's spec
>> for Socket A after (a certain point in time, about 3 years
>> ago, IIRC). I can't confirm that it does though, and
>> suggest you look again at the bios pages and motherboard
>> manual.
>
>Neither the manual nor the new BIOS (May 2005, replacing July 2004)
>mention anything about CPU thermal protection, and it wouldn't surprise
>me if this mobo didn't follow AMD specs because I found that all the
>fuses for the keyboard, mouse, and USB ports were replaced with jumper
>wires.

We should all be thankful that the board costs 25 cents less
I suppose... It's really sad how little some parts
omissions save. If PCCHips had a mind to, they could take
the mid-grade market easily by simply making decent boards.



>> I would be more concerned about proper cooling subsystem
>> design and good fan selection. It is rare for good, low RPM
>> fans to die. Don't use cheap, off-brand (meaning anything
>> not bearing a _fan_ manufacturer's label, not a 3rd party
>> label like Coolermaster or Antec or ???. While those two
>> and others do sell some products with decent fans, you don't
>> have an assurance of the actual fan they relabeled in all
>> cases (situations). Instead trust Nidec, NMB, Papst,
>> Panaflo, Sanyo, Delta, et al.
>
>Oddly, the only CPU fans to give me trouble were all Deltas provided
>with retail boxed AMD CPUs. Years ago, five K6-2 CPUs fans squealed
>loudly beause their rear sleeve bearings hadn't been lubed at the
>factory. Every Delta fan vibrated, and the one included with my Athlon
>XP1800+ was so bad that I asked AMD replaced it, but the replacement
>vibrated the same. OTOH the same heatsink sold by Coolermaster with a
>Coolermaster-labelled fan was buzz-free. I was also happy that this
>Sempron 3000+ came with a smooth-running fan, labelled AVS.

Were they thin(ner) fans? I omitted that important detail,
that the thin fans seem shortest lived. Thick, slow,
largest diameter possible... will probably be one of the
last parts to fail instead of one of the first. I still
have 10+ year old Panaflos that run great, even being
sleeve-bearing.


>
>I use an overtemperature shutoff device consisting of a quad comparator
>and some thermistors and have it monitor the CPU, graphics chip, and
>hard drives.

I may get motivated towards doing something like that,
though at present I've been trusting the board's shutoff
mechanism, and never having had to rely on it as I am quite
picky about the fans I used. When sleeve-bearing, they get
a special homebrew synthetic oil/grease lube that even
manages to keep those crappy Yate Loon fans running after
they'd seized up and fried power supplies... not that I'd
reuse them, but is all part of my ongoing effort to ensure
that (the odds are low) of my ever having to depend on a
thermal shutdown. Funny thing is that my volt-modded FX5900
video card probably produces more heat than anything else
but has the smallest fan (strapped onto a solid copper 1U
Xeon 'sink). It'll probably snap in half some day from the
weight of that 'sink, LOL.

kony wrote:
> On 14 Jun 2005 00:09:51 -0700, "larry moe 'n curly"
> <> wrote:

> >1. Does the PC Chips M825g mobo have built-in CPU overheat
> >protection?

> It's supposed to, as are all boards adhering to AMD's spec
> for Socket A after (a certain point in time, about 3 years
> ago, IIRC). I can't confirm that it does though, and
> suggest you look again at the bios pages and motherboard
> manual.

I looked at another M825g mobo and found a green lump thermistor
labelled RT1 in the center of the socket. It's not surface mount, so a
pot could be soldered to it on the other side of the mobo.

On 13 Jun 2005 12:30:22 -0700, "larry moe 'n curly"
<> wrote:

>I recently bought an AMD Sempron 3000+ (Socket A, Barton core, 512K L2
>cache) with PC Chips M825g mobo and noticed that this mobo's BIOS
>doesn't have a setting for enabling any CPU overheat protection
>shutdown.
>
>1. Does the PC Chips M825g mobo have built-in CPU overheat protection?

It should, though PC Chips is definitely a bottom-feeder when it comes
to quality, so I wouldn't be overly surprised if they skimped on this
sort of feature.

>2. Does the Socket A Sempron 3000+ have built-in CPU overheat
>protection as the Athlon64 CPUs do?

No, though to be fair, ALL current processors require a fair degree of
help from the motherboard. The built-in overheating protection on
newer chips just lets them crash slightly more gracefully, hopefully
ringing some alarms before the thing locks up.

>I realize that I can use MBM5 to shut down the computer in case it
>overheats, but I prefer protection that works even if Windows locks up.
> On my Duron CPU computer I have a hardware device to shut off the
>computer when the CPU gets too hot.

This would be normal and has been the case on virtually all
motherboards produced in about 7 or 8 years now. However, as
mentioned above, you never really know for sure when buying from the
bottom of the barrel.

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca