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FREEDOS on server

 
 
Allan Adler
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      11-28-2006, 08:35 AM

Over the Thanksgiving holiday, someone gave me a Linksys etherfast
Cable/DSL Router. I'm not interested in going online with it. I do
want to explore using it to give my machines some very limited
networking capabilities with each other. All of the machines have
versions of RedHat Linux running on them. One has 6.2, two have 7.1
and one has 7.3. In addition, the one with 7.3 has a FREEDOS partition.
Also, sometimes I have visitors who have laptops running Windows. I'm
told that in principle the Windows and Linux machines can talk to each
other through the router.

We were able to set up the router and two of the RH 7.1 systems so that they
could ping each other through the router. However, we couldn't go beyond that
because when I installed the operating system, I specifically rejected
installing anything that would let the machines function as servers. In
order to do any networking at all beyond pinging, I have to enable one of
the machines to function as a server. Suppose the machine in question is
denoted S. Then I can, I'm told, transfer files between any two other
machines X,Y by telling X to send the files to S and telling Y to download
them from S. That is very limited but as a first experiment in networking
it is fine with me. I'm not even sure that I will ever want to go beyond that.


I *could* just reinstall Linux on one of the machines so that it does have
the server software installed on it but I'd like to know whether I can just
let the FREEDOS partition on the RH 7.3 machine be the server. It just
strikes me as cute. Anyway, if this is feasible, how do I set it up?
--
Ignorantly,
Allan Adler <(E-Mail Removed)>
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT CSAIL. My actions and
* comments do not reflect in any way on MIT. Also, I am nowhere near Boston.
 
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Arno Wagner
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      11-28-2006, 09:35 AM
Previously Allan Adler <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Over the Thanksgiving holiday, someone gave me a Linksys etherfast
> Cable/DSL Router. I'm not interested in going online with it. I do
> want to explore using it to give my machines some very limited
> networking capabilities with each other. All of the machines have
> versions of RedHat Linux running on them. One has 6.2, two have 7.1
> and one has 7.3. In addition, the one with 7.3 has a FREEDOS partition.
> Also, sometimes I have visitors who have laptops running Windows. I'm
> told that in principle the Windows and Linux machines can talk to each
> other through the router.


> We were able to set up the router and two of the RH 7.1 systems so that they
> could ping each other through the router. However, we couldn't go beyond that
> because when I installed the operating system, I specifically rejected
> installing anything that would let the machines function as servers. In
> order to do any networking at all beyond pinging, I have to enable one of
> the machines to function as a server. Suppose the machine in question is
> denoted S. Then I can, I'm told, transfer files between any two other
> machines X,Y by telling X to send the files to S and telling Y to download
> them from S. That is very limited but as a first experiment in networking
> it is fine with me. I'm not even sure that I will ever want to go beyond that.



> I *could* just reinstall Linux on one of the machines so that it does have
> the server software installed on it but I'd like to know whether I can just
> let the FREEDOS partition on the RH 7.3 machine be the server. It just
> strikes me as cute. Anyway, if this is feasible, how do I set it up?


I don't think using FREEDOS as OS for the server makes much sense.
I am not sure there even is server software for FREEDOS. The least
you would need would be an FTP server, I think. With Linux
that is very easy.

Arno

 
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Allan Adler
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      12-01-2006, 02:26 AM

Arno Wagner writes:

>I don't think using FREEDOS as OS for the server makes much sense.
>I am not sure there even is server software for FREEDOS. The least
>you would need would be an FTP server, I think. With Linux
>that is very easy.


Since FREEDOS is supposed to be a drop in replacement for DOS, server
software doesn't necessarily have to be explicitly for FREEDOS.
I'd be perfectly content with an ftp server.

I don't mind doing it with Linux, but if I can do it with FREEDOS without
having to write the software myself, I would prefer it.

Suppose two DOS machines want to exchange files. How do they do it?
I've heard of null modem transfers, although I don't know anything about
them. So, if DOS can do that, why can't it passively accept files from and
tolerate downloads to other PC's running Linux? Maybe the problem is with
the other PC's, not with the machines running (FREE)DOS?
--
Ignorantly,
Allan Adler <(E-Mail Removed)>
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT CSAIL. My actions and
* comments do not reflect in any way on MIT. Also, I am nowhere near Boston.
 
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Arno Wagner
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      12-01-2006, 04:50 AM
Previously Allan Adler <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Arno Wagner writes:


>>I don't think using FREEDOS as OS for the server makes much sense.
>>I am not sure there even is server software for FREEDOS. The least
>>you would need would be an FTP server, I think. With Linux
>>that is very easy.


> Since FREEDOS is supposed to be a drop in replacement for DOS, server
> software doesn't necessarily have to be explicitly for FREEDOS.
> I'd be perfectly content with an ftp server.


OK, rephrase: I am not sure there is an FTP-Server for DOS....

> I don't mind doing it with Linux, but if I can do it with FREEDOS without
> having to write the software myself, I would prefer it.


> Suppose two DOS machines want to exchange files. How do they do it?
> I've heard of null modem transfers, although I don't know anything about
> them. So, if DOS can do that, why can't it passively accept files from and
> tolerate downloads to other PC's running Linux?


Null-modem stransfers are usually done with a terminal programm on
both sides and manyal control....

> Maybe the problem is with
> the other PC's, not with the machines running (FREE)DOS?


Dos is not really a server OS. When it had its good days, there was no
Internet at home. The best you could hope for was a modem connection
to a BBS. As a consequence, nobody wrote the type of application
you would need. DOS does not even support network cards for
Internet connectivity. There may be a way by using some obscure
software, but Linux is really the way to go, since it was designed
with Internet connectivity in Mind, just like any other Unix-like
OS.

Arno
 
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Allan Adler
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      12-01-2006, 10:39 AM
Arno Wagner <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> Dos is not really a server OS. When it had its good days, there was no
> Internet at home. The best you could hope for was a modem connection
> to a BBS. As a consequence, nobody wrote the type of application
> you would need. DOS does not even support network cards for
> Internet connectivity. There may be a way by using some obscure
> software, but Linux is really the way to go, since it was designed
> with Internet connectivity in Mind, just like any other Unix-like
> OS.


I'm not proposing to go online with this. I just want to enable computers
at home to talk to a particular computer at home. I'm sure Linux is better,
but I want to explore this first. It happens that some of the computers
are running Linux, but I want the main one they talk to to be FREEDOS.

If necessary, I'll put a FREEDOS partition on all of the computers and
let the FREEDOS partitions talk to each other.

You say that a terminal program and manual transfer is required, i.e.
it is both necessary and sufficient for doing this. That's progress.
What would I use? Kermit?

I found one website that mentions parallel transfers via printer ports
for machines running DOS but it doesn't give any details. In principle,
I could chase that down. But that doesn't use the new piece of equipment
I acquired, the router.

True or false: There is no way to transfer files between (FREE)DOS
machines if the connection between them goes through the Linksys etherfast
Cable/DSL Router?

I know this is a lot like buying a car and then pushing it everywhere
I want to go. I just want the experience if it is possible.
--
Ignorantly,
Allan Adler <(E-Mail Removed)>
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT CSAIL. My actions and
* comments do not reflect in any way on MIT. Also, I am nowhere near Boston.
 
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Arno Wagner
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-01-2006, 03:21 PM
Previously Allan Adler <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Arno Wagner <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:


>> Dos is not really a server OS. When it had its good days, there was no
>> Internet at home. The best you could hope for was a modem connection
>> to a BBS. As a consequence, nobody wrote the type of application
>> you would need. DOS does not even support network cards for
>> Internet connectivity. There may be a way by using some obscure
>> software, but Linux is really the way to go, since it was designed
>> with Internet connectivity in Mind, just like any other Unix-like
>> OS.


> I'm not proposing to go online with this. I just want to enable computers
> at home to talk to a particular computer at home. I'm sure Linux is better,
> but I want to explore this first. It happens that some of the computers
> are running Linux, but I want the main one they talk to to be FREEDOS.


> If necessary, I'll put a FREEDOS partition on all of the computers and
> let the FREEDOS partitions talk to each other.


> You say that a terminal program and manual transfer is required, i.e.
> it is both necessary and sufficient for doing this. That's progress.
> What would I use? Kermit?


For example. But you will get something like 10kB/sec transfer rates
over a serial line.

> I found one website that mentions parallel transfers via printer ports
> for machines running DOS but it doesn't give any details. In principle,
> I could chase that down. But that doesn't use the new piece of equipment
> I acquired, the router.


> True or false: There is no way to transfer files between (FREE)DOS
> machines if the connection between them goes through the Linksys etherfast
> Cable/DSL Router?


Well, if you add a network card driver and a TCP/IP stack and some
networking software, then it is possible. I have no idea whether
this is available for freedos and whether it fits into the
memory. Come to think of it, I seem to remember surfing the
web with Windows 3.1, so there must be network stacks for
DOS. No idea where you sould get one. And it definitely was not
usable for a server and did only support the serial line, so
no ethernet support.

Hmmm. The other option I would see is to put netware on the
DOS machine. I _think_ Linux can still talk to that.
But that would replace the DOS altogether. NetWare light maybe?
Or maybe FREEDOS has a networking extension?

> I know this is a lot like buying a car and then pushing it everywhere
> I want to go. I just want the experience if it is possible.


What you are trying to do is to open a passenger transport business,
but you use the airplanes only on the ground in taxi-mode, since the
pilot (OS) has no fligh license....

DOS is just not suitable to be used as a server of any kind.

Arno
 
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