List View: Calculate all sizes Default?

Often I want to sort a list of files in a folder by size. So I go to
List View in Finder, but no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
folder. Is there any way of having Finder in List View always calculate
sizes of folders? Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button? I
suppose I could use Path Finder but for jobs like this Finder is better
due to its speed. Path Finder slows up a lot when multiple windows are
used. So Finder is the best for sorting and moving quickly - especially
when you need 2 or more windows to be switching back and forth from.

In article harry-, Harry at
wrote on 11/24/08 1:01 AM:

> .... no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
> as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
> thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
> folder. .... Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button?


I can't find one. In fact, IIRC, it doesn't work consistently even with the
same folder.

(Well, at least I know it's not just me and/or my iMac. )


--
iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) € OS X (10.5.4)

In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
at wrote on 11/24/08 12:24 PM:

> In article <harry->,
> Harry <> wrote:
>
>> Often I want to sort a list of files in a folder by size. So I go to
>> List View in Finder, but no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
>> as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
>> thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
>> folder. Is there any way of having Finder in List View always calculate
>> sizes of folders? Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button?
>
> Hmm... I just tested this on my system and it works the way i would
> expect. After opening one folder, checking "Calculate All Sizes" and
> clicking "Use As Defaults", when I open other windows,"Calculate All
> Sizes" is on.



If it's supposed to work as advertised, using it once should be enough. Yet
I find myself doing it over and over again, virtually every time I open a
folder. Having said that, I will also say that many folders seem to retain
the size info in the column view. It's those that don't that I find myself
faced with having to repeat the exercise. And there's no obvious pattern.
All that's absolutely clear is that I routinely find myself checking the
"Calculate All Sizes" box, followed by clicking the "Use as Defaults"
button.


--
iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) € OS X (10.5.4)

In article <jollyroger->,
Jolly Roger <> wrote:

> In article <harry->,
> Harry <> wrote:
>
> > Often I want to sort a list of files in a folder by size. So I go to
> > List View in Finder, but no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
> > as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
> > thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
> > folder. Is there any way of having Finder in List View always calculate
> > sizes of folders? Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button?
>
> Hmm... I just tested this on my system and it works the way i would
> expect. After opening one folder, checking "Calculate All Sizes" and
> clicking "Use As Defaults", when I open other windows,"Calculate All
> Sizes" is on.

Hey JR, how come your system always seems to work so well? We are
jealous....

> > > > Often I want to sort a list of files in a folder by size. So I go to
> > > > List View in Finder, but no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
> > > > as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
> > > > thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
> > > > folder. Is there any way of having Finder in List View always
> > > > calculate
> > > > sizes of folders? Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button?
> > >
> > > Hmm... I just tested this on my system and it works the way i would
> > > expect. After opening one folder, checking "Calculate All Sizes" and
> > > clicking "Use As Defaults", when I open other windows,"Calculate All
> > > Sizes" is on.
> >
> > Hey JR, how come your system always seems to work so well? We are
> > jealous....
>
> Maybe because I don't have Disk Warrior, virus "protection" and other
> wasteful things installed, or run "repair permissions" at the slightest
> drop of a hat? : D

Well I don't have Disk Warrior (at least I never use it), virus
protection running. Activity Monitor shows a pretty lean setup. I'm
learning to think minimalistic.

Here's what is running now. See anything I could rid myself of that is
running unnecessarily? The only 2 columns I have displayed are CPU and
Real Memory. I deleted the others so the numbers would display better
here.
Process Name - CPU - Real Memory
Activity Monitor 2.2 14.81 MB
Adobe Reader 0.1 67.86 MB
AirPort Base Station Agent 0.0 3.04 MB
AppleSpell.service 0.0 4.34 MB
ATSServer 0.0 4.83 MB
Dock 0.2 5.18 MB
Finder 0.0 30.91 MB
Folder Actions Dispatcher 0.0 2.82 MB
IOXperts Session Monitor 0.0 2.07 MB
launchd 0.0 528.00 KB
LazyMouseBG 0.0 6.05 MB
Little Snitch Network Monitor 1.0 4.27 MB
Little Snitch UIAgent 0.0 6.16 MB
loginwindow 0.0 5.10 MB
Mail 0.1 39.99 MB
MicrosoftKeyboardHelper 0.1 2.34 MB
MicrosoftMouseHelper 0.1 2.39 MB
MT-NewsWatcher 2.5 26.89 MB
Opera 0.3 32.91 MB
pboard 0.0 588.00 KB
SystemUIServer 0.0 6.73 MB
TextEdit 0.0 15.00 MB
UserEventAgent 0.0 2.11 MB

> I always take a scientific approach to diagnosing the problems I do
> encounter. I tend to try to learn what's *causing* a problem - before
> taking any actions to solve it. For instance, when my system misbehaves,
> I refrain from making any changes or running things that might cause
> changes, and instead look at the logs and do other diagnostics to check
> various health indicators of the system. Once I'm pretty sure what's
> causing the problem, I take only those actions that directly pertain to
> it, and I track the effects those actions have on the issue every step
> of the way. I take notes sometimes to help me keep track. It takes
> patience, but makes for an enlightening experience, and usually means I
> know exactly what caused the problem and, more importantly, how to avoid
> it in the future. That may have something to do with it too. I've had my
> share of problems, but I've learned from a lot of them, and follow
> certain personal best practices to avoid them in the future.
>
> And maybe I'm just a little lucky too. : D

Nothing like a little dose of common sense every day.

In article <jollyroger->,
Jolly Roger <> wrote:

> In article <C55051F2.1C8A4%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
> > at wrote on 11/24/08 12:24 PM:
> >
> > > In article <harry->,
> > > Harry <> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Often I want to sort a list of files in a folder by size. So I go to
> > >> List View in Finder, but no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
> > >> as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
> > >> thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
> > >> folder. Is there any way of having Finder in List View always calculate
> > >> sizes of folders? Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button?
> > >
> > > Hmm... I just tested this on my system and it works the way i would
> > > expect. After opening one folder, checking "Calculate All Sizes" and
> > > clicking "Use As Defaults", when I open other windows,"Calculate All
> > > Sizes" is on.
> >
> > If it's supposed to work as advertised, using it once should be enough. Yet
> > I find myself doing it over and over again, virtually every time I open a
> > folder. Having said that, I will also say that many folders seem to retain
> > the size info in the column view. It's those that don't that I find myself
> > faced with having to repeat the exercise. And there's no obvious pattern.
> > All that's absolutely clear is that I routinely find myself checking the
> > "Calculate All Sizes" box, followed by clicking the "Use as Defaults"
> > button.
>
> Remember that the system keeps track of this information with invisible
> .DS_Store files inside of each folder. If you introduce a folder with an
> existing .DS_Store file that has different settings, the folder might
> look different when you open it. And if that .DS_Store file isn't
> writable by your user account, view setting changes you make for that
> folder won't get saved, and the next time you run the FInder (after a
> logout / restart), they will revert back to the settings in the
> .DS_Store file.
>
> Apple made a really stupid decision with .DS_Store files. I look forward
> to the day they finally eradicate them from the operating system.

So any idea why your system is consistent and other systems like mine are not?

In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
at wrote on 11/24/08 3:47 PM:

> In article <C55051F2.1C8A4%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
>> at wrote on 11/24/08 12:24 PM:
>>
>>> In article <harry->,
>>> Harry <> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Often I want to sort a list of files in a folder by size. So I go to
>>>> List View in Finder, but no matter how many times I ask Finder to "Use
>>>> as Defaults" after checking "Calculate All Sizes" I have to do the same
>>>> thing over and over every time List View pops up with a different
>>>> folder. Is there any way of having Finder in List View always calculate
>>>> sizes of folders? Is there any point to the Use as Defaults button?
>>>
>>> Hmm... I just tested this on my system and it works the way i would
>>> expect. After opening one folder, checking "Calculate All Sizes" and
>>> clicking "Use As Defaults", when I open other windows,"Calculate All
>>> Sizes" is on.
>>
>> If it's supposed to work as advertised, using it once should be enough. Yet
>> I find myself doing it over and over again, virtually every time I open a
>> folder. Having said that, I will also say that many folders seem to retain
>> the size info in the column view. It's those that don't that I find myself
>> faced with having to repeat the exercise. And there's no obvious pattern.
>> All that's absolutely clear is that I routinely find myself checking the
>> "Calculate All Sizes" box, followed by clicking the "Use as Defaults"
>> button.
>
> Remember that the system keeps track of this information with invisible
> .DS_Store files inside of each folder. If you introduce a folder with an
>
> existing .DS_Store file that has different settings, the folder might
> look different when you open it. And if that .DS_Store file isn't
> writable by your user account, view setting changes you make for that
> folder won't get saved, and the next time you run the FInder (after a
> logout / restart), they will revert back to the settings in the
> .DS_Store file.
>

Is there something that I may inadvertently be doing to create the almost
constant need to tell the system to "Calculate All Sizes" and "Use as
Defaults" when I open windows? AFAIK, I haven't engaged in any activities
that might delete or change .DS_Store files (or other "invisibles" OS X
uses). I lack the understanding that you have (I'm a rather new OS 9-to-OS X
migrator, and the learning curve is a tad steep); knowing what I do know and
(more importantly) what I don't know tends determine how I approach dealing
with "problems" that I _think_ I may be having. (In other words, I know
enough to try to take a conservative, "if you ain't sure, don't do it"
troubleshooting approach.)



>
> Apple made a really stupid decision with .DS_Store files. I look forward
> to the day they finally eradicate them from the operating system.

....and I'm still waiting to be nominated for the Nobel Prize.

--
iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) € OS X (10.5.4)

In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
at wrote on 11/24/08 6:32 PM:

> In article <C550956B.1CA57%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
>> at wrote on 11/24/08 3:47 PM:
>>
>>> In article <C55051F2.1C8A4%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
>>> Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article jollyroger-, Jolly
>>>> Roger
>>>> at wrote on 11/24/08 12:24 PM:
>>>>
>>> Remember that the system keeps track of this information with invisible
>>> .DS_Store files inside of each folder. If you introduce a folder with an
>>> existing .DS_Store file that has different settings, the folder might
>>> look different when you open it. And if that .DS_Store file isn't
>>> writable by your user account, view setting changes you make for that
>>> folder won't get saved, and the next time you run the FInder (after a
>>> logout / restart), they will revert back to the settings in the
>>> .DS_Store file.
>>
>> Is there something that I may inadvertently be doing to create the almost
>> constant need to tell the system to "Calculate All Sizes" and "Use as
>> Defaults" when I open windows?
>
> That's hard to say without knowing your usage habits.
>
>> AFAIK, I haven't engaged in any activities
>> that might delete or change .DS_Store files (or other "invisibles" OS X
>> uses). I lack the understanding that you have (I'm a rather new OS 9-to-OS X
>> migrator, and the learning curve is a tad steep); knowing what I do know and
>> (more importantly) what I don't know tends determine how I approach dealing
>> with "problems" that I _think_ I may be having. (In other words, I know
>> enough to try to take a conservative, "if you ain't sure, don't do it"
>> troubleshooting approach.)
>
> If you don't specifically add comments to the Info window for items in
> the effected folders, you are safe to delete the .DS_Store files, which
> will, in effect, reset the view options for the folders to a ultra-clean
> state. Once you've deleted them, setting view options will cause new
> ones to be created, and those should stick from that point on (until the
> next hiccup, that is - Apple's .DS_Store system isn't without flaw).
>
> I've written a script that will trash all .DS_Store files in folders
> dropped onto it. Feel free to use it:
>
> <http://jollyroger.kicks-ass.org/software/Trash%20.DS_Store%20Files.zip>

Before I start deleting those files, perhaps you can help clarify something.
You previously said:

> Remember that the system keeps track of this information with invisible
> .DS_Store files inside of each folder. If you introduce a folder with an
> existing .DS_Store file that has different settings, ..."


Different from what?


> ... the folder might
> look different when you open it."

I don't understand.


> And if that .DS_Store file isn't
> writable by your user account, view setting changes you make for that
> folder won't get saved, and the next time you run the FInder (after a
> logout / restart), they will revert back to the settings in the
> .DS_Store file."

Again, I'm unclear. I'm the only user; mine (Admin) the only account (except
for a "test user" account I created back in June, to test problems I was
having setting up Mail.app; turns out there was nothing wrong with the
software...just an issue with my ISP's mail server when talking to Mail.app
accounts. I've never used/logged in to that "test" account since). So why
would some folders contain "unwritable" .DS_Store files, and others not?


--
iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) € OS X (10.5.4)

In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
at wrote on 11/24/08 7:18 PM:

> In article <C550AA58.1CA68%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> In article jollyroger-, Jolly Roger
>> at wrote on 11/24/08 6:32 PM:
>>
>>> If you don't specifically add comments to the Info window for items in
>>> the effected folders, you are safe to delete the .DS_Store files, which
>>> will, in effect, reset the view options for the folders to a ultra-clean
>>> state. Once you've deleted them, setting view options will cause new
>>> ones to be created, and those should stick from that point on (until the
>>> next hiccup, that is - Apple's .DS_Store system isn't without flaw).
>>>
>>> I've written a script that will trash all .DS_Store files in folders
>>> dropped onto it. Feel free to use it:
>>>
>>> <http://jollyroger.kicks-ass.org/software/Trash%20.DS_Store%20Files.zip>
>>
>> Before I start deleting those files, perhaps you can help clarify something.
>> You previously said:
>>
>>> Remember that the system keeps track of this information with invisible
>>> .DS_Store files inside of each folder. If you introduce a folder with an
>>> existing .DS_Store file that has different settings, ..."
>>
>> Different from what?
>>
>>> ... the folder might
>>> look different when you open it."
>>
>> I don't understand.
>
> See all the options in the Finder's "View Options" pallette (the one you
> get when you choose View > Show View Options from the menu bar)? If a
> folder has an existing .DS_Store file (perhaps a folder you copied from
> another Mac, for instance), those settings may be different than what
> you'd expect them to be on your machine.
>
>>> And if that .DS_Store file isn't
>>> writable by your user account, view setting changes you make for that
>>> folder won't get saved, and the next time you run the FInder (after a
>>> logout / restart), they will revert back to the settings in the
>>> .DS_Store file."
>>
>> Again, I'm unclear. I'm the only user; mine (Admin) the only account (except
>> for a "test user" account I created back in June, to test problems I was
>> having setting up Mail.app; turns out there was nothing wrong with the
>> software...just an issue with my ISP's mail server when talking to Mail.app
>> accounts. I've never used/logged in to that "test" account since). So why
>> would some folders contain "unwritable" .DS_Store files, and others not?
>
> It depends on which specific folders we're talking about, but just know
> that some files and folders are copied to your Mac from all sorts of
> places. Software you install, files and folders you download off the
> net, and so on - all of these can have their own hidden .DS_Store files
> embedded in them with view settings that differ from your own.


OK. So the bottom line is that the refusal of the "Calculate All Sizes" and
"Use as Defaults" choice to "stick" is due to those pesky .DS_Store files,
right? And that's what you meant when you said:

> Apple made a really stupid decision with .DS_Store files. I look forward
> to the day they finally eradicate them from the operating system.

(Hmmm...what would replace the intended functionality of those files if
Apple itches them?)




--
iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) € OS X (10.5.4)

On 2008-11-24, Jolly Roger <> wrote:

> I've written a script that will trash all .DS_Store files in folders
> dropped onto it. Feel free to use it:
>
><http://jollyroger.kicks-ass.org/software/Trash%20.DS_Store%20Files.zip>

I don't make use of any facilities that depend on the existence of
..DS_Store files. This is one of those cases where (for me and the way I
currently use my Mac) consistency and simplicity win out over
customisability. So every once in a while I purge any that have set seed
in my home directory using the command:

find ~ -name .DS_Store -delete

As a result, if I set the Finder to column view (my favourite for
general use) then it stays in column view as I navigate around folders
because there are no .DS_Store files telling it to open particular
folders in other views. Well that is how I assume it works.

But then again, I don't use the Finder very often - I launch apps from
the Dock and most of my directory navigation is done either in the
open/save dialog of apps or using ls(1) in Terminal.app.

Ian

--
Ian Gregory
http://www.zenatode.org.uk/ian/