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Re: Harddrive install question : size?

 
 
Ben Myers
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      08-14-2009, 04:52 AM
Larry wrote:
> Insatalled a 160gb wd in a gateway MX6440 laptop and all i see is 149gb
> totel size with 145gb free. how do i get the full drive?
> Thanks Larry


It all depends on how you do the math. But no matter what, 1K does not
equal 1000. But then there's Microsoft math, a leftover from the days
when assembly programmers would save some clock cycles by avoiding a
time-consuming divide by 1000. Instead, they shifted the number right
10 bits (or dropping the rightmost 10 bits, if you'd rather)... Ben Myers
 
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Ken Whiton
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      08-14-2009, 06:32 AM
*-* On Fri, 14 Aug 2009, at 00:12:36 -0500,
*-* In Article <Xns9C66E1EE2B9FDLarrynospammenet@216.196.97.130 >,
*-* Larry wrote
*-* About Re: Harddrive install question : size?

> Ben Myers <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:h62r1n$bq3$(E-Mail Removed)-september.org:


>> Larry wrote:
>>> Insatalled a 160gb wd in a gateway MX6440 laptop and all i see is
>>> 149gb totel size with 145gb free. how do i get the full drive?
>>> Thanks Larry


>> It all depends on how you do the math. But no matter what, 1K does
>> not equal 1000. But then there's Microsoft math, a leftover from
>> the days when assembly programmers would save some clock cycles by
>> avoiding a time-consuming divide by 1000. Instead, they shifted
>> the number right 10 bits (or dropping the rightmost 10 bits, if
>> you'd rather)... Ben Myers


> Thanks Ben ! So 149 is the full size!. It would help if they just
> used real numbers. You see 160 but it's a illusion.


I wouldn't call it an illusion. It's the difference between
decimal (powers of 10 - 10, 100, 1,000, 10,000, etc.) and binary
(powers of 2 - 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, etc.) math. In decimal math,
kilo- is 1,000. In binary math the closest power of 2 is 1,024, so
that came to be known as kilo- as the closest approximation.
Unfortunately, as you go up the scale, the difference becomes much
greater.

Decimal Binary

KiloByte (KB) 1,000 Bytes 1,024 Bytes
MegaByte (MB) 1,000,000 " 1,048,576 "
GigaByte (GB) 1,000,000,000 " 1,073,741,824 "

Hard drive manufacturers use decimal numbers to measure the
capacity of drives, so your 160 GB drive is 160,000,000,000 bytes.
Computers are binary devices (1/0, +/-, yes/no, however you want to
think of the process), so they "see" hard drives in binary terms, so
your computer sees that "160 GB" drive as
160,000,000,000/1,073,741,824 (or 149.0116) GB. The same relationship
applies to all hard drives (and other storage devices) whether OEM,
replacement, or whatever. As you can see from this example,
manufacturers measure capacity decimally because it allows them to
claim a larger capacity for a given size drive, and years ago, when
the practice started, the differences weren't as significant.

> Thanks Larry


You're welcome.

Ken Whiton
--
FIDO: 1:132/152
InterNet: (E-Mail Removed) (remove the obvious to reply)
 
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BillW50
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      08-14-2009, 11:55 AM
In news:(E-Mail Removed),
Ken Whiton typed on Fri, 14 Aug 2009 02:32:42 -0400:
> I wouldn't call it an illusion. It's the difference between
> decimal (powers of 10 - 10, 100, 1,000, 10,000, etc.) and binary
> (powers of 2 - 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, etc.) math. In decimal math,
> kilo- is 1,000. In binary math the closest power of 2 is 1,024, so
> that came to be known as kilo- as the closest approximation.
> Unfortunately, as you go up the scale, the difference becomes much
> greater.
>
> Decimal Binary
>
> KiloByte (KB) 1,000 Bytes 1,024 Bytes
> MegaByte (MB) 1,000,000 " 1,048,576 "
> GigaByte (GB) 1,000,000,000 " 1,073,741,824 "
>
> Hard drive manufacturers use decimal numbers to measure the
> capacity of drives, so your 160 GB drive is 160,000,000,000 bytes.
> Computers are binary devices (1/0, +/-, yes/no, however you want to
> think of the process), so they "see" hard drives in binary terms, so
> your computer sees that "160 GB" drive as
> 160,000,000,000/1,073,741,824 (or 149.0116) GB. The same relationship
> applies to all hard drives (and other storage devices) whether OEM,
> replacement, or whatever. As you can see from this example,
> manufacturers measure capacity decimally because it allows them to
> claim a larger capacity for a given size drive, and years ago, when
> the practice started, the differences weren't as significant.
>
>> Thanks Larry

>
> You're welcome.
>
> Ken Whiton


Also to add, don't forget the drive compacity is measured before
formatting. Like McDonald's Quarter Pounder is a quarter pound before
cooking. After formatting, you lose some of the free space as well.

--
Bill
Gateway MX6124 ('06 era) - Windows XP SP2


 
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Ben Myers
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      08-14-2009, 02:03 PM
Larry wrote:
> Ben Myers <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:h62r1n$bq3$(E-Mail Removed)-september.org:
>
>> Larry wrote:
>>> Insatalled a 160gb wd in a gateway MX6440 laptop and all i see is
>>> 149gb totel size with 145gb free. how do i get the full drive?
>>> Thanks Larry

>> It all depends on how you do the math. But no matter what, 1K does
>> not equal 1000. But then there's Microsoft math, a leftover from the
>> days when assembly programmers would save some clock cycles by
>> avoiding a time-consuming divide by 1000. Instead, they shifted the
>> number right 10 bits (or dropping the rightmost 10 bits, if you'd
>> rather)... Ben Myers
>>

>
> Thanks Ben ! So 149 is the full size!. It would help if they just used
> real numbers. You see 160 but it's a illusion.
> Thanks Larry


If you right click the drive letter in My Computer, and then click on
Properties, you'll get to see both numbers. The honest to gosh real
base 10 decimal number followed by the mangled-by-1K number... Ben Myers
 
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Ben Myers
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      08-14-2009, 02:07 PM
BillW50 wrote:
> In news:(E-Mail Removed),
> Ken Whiton typed on Fri, 14 Aug 2009 02:32:42 -0400:
>> I wouldn't call it an illusion. It's the difference between
>> decimal (powers of 10 - 10, 100, 1,000, 10,000, etc.) and binary
>> (powers of 2 - 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, etc.) math. In decimal math,
>> kilo- is 1,000. In binary math the closest power of 2 is 1,024, so
>> that came to be known as kilo- as the closest approximation.
>> Unfortunately, as you go up the scale, the difference becomes much
>> greater.
>>
>> Decimal Binary
>>
>> KiloByte (KB) 1,000 Bytes 1,024 Bytes
>> MegaByte (MB) 1,000,000 " 1,048,576 "
>> GigaByte (GB) 1,000,000,000 " 1,073,741,824 "
>>
>> Hard drive manufacturers use decimal numbers to measure the
>> capacity of drives, so your 160 GB drive is 160,000,000,000 bytes.
>> Computers are binary devices (1/0, +/-, yes/no, however you want to
>> think of the process), so they "see" hard drives in binary terms, so
>> your computer sees that "160 GB" drive as
>> 160,000,000,000/1,073,741,824 (or 149.0116) GB. The same relationship
>> applies to all hard drives (and other storage devices) whether OEM,
>> replacement, or whatever. As you can see from this example,
>> manufacturers measure capacity decimally because it allows them to
>> claim a larger capacity for a given size drive, and years ago, when
>> the practice started, the differences weren't as significant.
>>
>>> Thanks Larry

>> You're welcome.
>>
>> Ken Whiton

>
> Also to add, don't forget the drive compacity is measured before
> formatting. Like McDonald's Quarter Pounder is a quarter pound before
> cooking. After formatting, you lose some of the free space as well.
>


The loss of some capacity due to formatting is acceptable. No matter
what the file system, you can't format a drive without taking up some
space for file system tables. And more space is left after formatting
than McDonald's gives you with a cooked Quarter Pounder.

It's Microsoft's mindless insistence on using K that is confusing to
many and downright stupid to some of us... Ben Myers
 
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