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IBM Rapid Restore

Discussion in 'IBM Thinkpad' started by Teflon, Oct 7, 2009.

  1. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    I now understand TV R&R on my R51 TP, now I'm ready to tackle my
    wife's T41, which has IBM Rapid Restore as the back-up utility.

    First question, is IBM RR equivalent to TV RR? If not, which is
    better? She has all of the ThinkVantage utilities, with the exception
    of R&R. She has never done a System Update.

    She has not knowingly backed up her system, but there are 2 files
    under 'Single File Restore' that were created in 2004 and again in
    2005. Each one appears to contain all the files on her system. I can
    not right-click these files to see how large they are, but I gotta
    believe they are taking a lot of space on her HD.

    I would like to delete these files, then connect her system to a USB
    HDD and create a current back-up of her system on the USB device using
    IBM RR. I don't want to backup the IBM RR files, however, I don't
    seem to be able to find a way to delete these files via IBM Rapid
    Restore.

    Is there a correct way to go about deleting them?

    Her system does not have Computer Management in the All Programs
    listings. I was trying to get to Disk Management. Is there another
    way to get there?
    Teflon, Oct 7, 2009
    #1
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  2. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 6, 6:36 pm, Teflon <> wrote:
    > I now understand TV R&R on my R51 TP, now I'm ready to tackle my
    > wife's T41, which has IBM Rapid Restore as the back-up utility.
    >

    Sorry, I forgot to mention that the machine has XP Pro, SP3 and a
    30GB HD.

    Trying to free up some HD real estate for her, and save her the
    anguish of restoring from scratch when the HD fails, and it will fail.

    Thanks for all your advice.
    Teflon, Oct 7, 2009
    #2
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  3. Teflon

    Teflon Guest


    > >I would like to delete these files, then connect her system to a USB
    > >HDD and create a current back-up of her system on the USB device using
    > >IBM RR.  I don't want to backup the IBM RR files, however, I don't
    > >seem to be able to find a way to delete these files via IBM Rapid
    > >Restore.

    >
    > >Is there a correct way to go about deleting them?

    >
    > Use this procedure:
    > <http://doe.k12.hi.us/technology/ctci/removingbackupfiles.pdf>
    > Or just uninstall Rapid Restore Ultra.


    Neither option worked, mainly, because Rapid Restore Ultra does not
    seem to be installed. It is not listed in Add/Remove Programs, so I
    apparently can't uninstall that which is not installed. It may have
    gotten uninstalled by MSFT's Live maintenance offering, which she had
    for several years.

    There is still a shortcut in Access IBM that brings up the first RR
    Ultra screen, but none of the buttons are active. BTW, is Access IBM
    still viable? Can not find anything regarding RR Ultra via Search,
    other than the Single File Restore folder.

    So, what is the next step for getting the Single File Restore folder
    deleted? None of the Delete, etc. options work, of course, since I
    believe it is labeled as a System Folder.


     
    Teflon, Oct 20, 2009
    #3
  4. Teflon

    Teflon Guest


    > >Her system does not have Computer Management in the All Programs
    > >listings.  I was trying to get to Disk Management.  Is there another
    > >way to get there?

    >
    > Right-click on My Computer, and left-click on Manage in the pop-up menu.
    > Or Run "compmgmt.msc".
    >


    That worked. Disk Management shows a hidden IBM Service partition
    (E:) is occupying 9.5GB of the HDD. Isn't that a little excessive? I
    used Marcium Reflect to make a copy of it, plus C: on an external
    HDD. Could I now just delete that Service partition? If so, how do I
    get make that 9.5GB to be reallocated to the C: partition?
    Teflon, Oct 20, 2009
    #4
  5. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 20, 1:32 pm, John Navas <> wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:32:58 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > <> wrote in
    > <>:
    >
    > >> >Her system does not have Computer Management in the All Programs
    > >> >listings.  I was trying to get to Disk Management.  Is there another
    > >> >way to get there?

    >
    > >> Right-click on My Computer, and left-click on Manage in the pop-up menu.
    > >> Or Run "compmgmt.msc".

    >
    > >That worked.  Disk Management shows a hidden IBM Service partition
    > >(E:) is occupying 9.5GB of the HDD.  Isn't that a little excessive?  

    >
    > A little -- I think it's 5 GB on the ThinkPad I'm using at the moment.
    >
    > >I
    > >used Marcium Reflect to make a copy of it, plus C: on an external
    > >HDD.  Could I now just delete that Service partition?

    >
    > Yes, but I wouldn't advise it, unless you're *sure* Marcium Reflect can
    > properly restore it.  I'd use the official method of backup instead.
    >
    > >If so, how do I
    > >get make that 9.5GB to be reallocated to the C: partition?

    >
    > You'll need something like Paragon Partition Manager.
    >
    > Do you ever say thanks, or do you just demand answers?
    >


    Sorry about that John. Did not realize my e-communications were
    coming off as demanding. After having screwed up enough things in the
    past 71 years, by not doing the proper due diligence, I guess I do ask
    a lot of questions. Just trying to lessen the possibility of my
    screwing up yet something else.

    Of course I appreciate your help, thought I had expressed that early
    on. Thanks again.

    > --
    > Best regards,    You are cordially invited to participate in the
    > John             official ThinkPad group news:comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad
    Teflon, Oct 21, 2009
    #5
  6. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 20, 1:28 pm, John Navas <> wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:26:12 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > <> wrote in
    > <>:
    >
    >
    >
    > >> >I would like to delete these files, then connect her system to a USB
    > >> >HDD and create a current back-up of her system on the USB device using
    > >> >IBM RR.  I don't want to backup the IBM RR files, however, I don't
    > >> >seem to be able to find a way to delete these files via IBM Rapid
    > >> >Restore.

    >
    > >> >Is there a correct way to go about deleting them?

    >
    > >> Use this procedure:
    > >> <http://doe.k12.hi.us/technology/ctci/removingbackupfiles.pdf>
    > >> Or just uninstall Rapid Restore Ultra.

    >
    > >Neither option worked, mainly, because Rapid Restore Ultra does not
    > >seem to be installed.  It is not listed in Add/Remove Programs, so I
    > >apparently can't uninstall that which is not installed.  It may have
    > >gotten uninstalled by MSFT's Live maintenance offering, which she had
    > >for several years.

    >
    > Try reinstall and then uninstall.


    Thanks.

    I thought of doing that, but have no idea where to find a copy of that
    old version of IBM RR to reinstall. Perhaps you can point me in the
    right direction.

    Tried searching the Lenovo site, but all I found was the latest
    version of TV R&R, which you had already pointed me to. I assumed
    that would not work to get rid of those old IBM RR backup files.

    Google wasn't any help either.

    Thanks.
    Teflon, Oct 21, 2009
    #6
  7. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 21, 6:48 am, John Navas <> wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 06:18:41 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > <> wrote in
    > <>:
    >
    > >On Oct 20, 1:28 pm, John Navas <> wrote:
    > >> Try reinstall and then uninstall.

    >
    > >Thanks.

    >
    > >I thought of doing that, but have no idea where to find a copy of that
    > >old version of IBM RR to reinstall.  Perhaps you can point me in the
    > >right direction.

    >
    > It should still be available in the preinstalled software section.
    > In the T41, it's in the \SWTOOLS tree.
    > It should also be in the hidden restore partition.


    I thought I had to use RR to access that partition? Will look in
    SWTOOLS and see what I find. Thanks for the pointer.

    >
    > >Tried searching the Lenovo site, but all I found was the latest
    > >version of TV R&R, which you had already pointed me to.  I assumed
    > >that would not work to get rid of those old IBM RR backup files.

    >
    > Assumptions, the mother of all screwups.


    Ain't it the truth.

    > Try
    > <http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=MIGR-5....>
    >
    > >Google wasn't any help either.

    >
    > That's how I found the above.


    I've found with Google, it also helps to know what one is looking for.

    Thanks again, John.

    >
    > --
    > Best regards,    You are cordially invited to participate in the
    > John             official ThinkPad group news:comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad
    Teflon, Oct 21, 2009
    #7
  8. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 21, 8:41 am, John Navas <> wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 08:28:57 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > <> wrote in
    > <>:
    >
    > >On Oct 21, 6:48 am, John Navas <> wrote:
    > >> It should still be available in the preinstalled software section.
    > >> In the T41, it's in the \SWTOOLS tree.
    > >> It should also be in the hidden restore partition.

    >
    > >I thought I had to use RR to access that partition?  Will look in
    > >SWTOOLS and see what I find.  Thanks for the pointer.


    Did a Search of all System / Hidden / etc. files and did not find
    SWTOOLS. Maybe that was the wrong way to find \SWTOOLS.

    >
    > The hidden partition is what holds the Predesktop Area,
    > accessed with the special button when booting.


    I tried early on, and I seem to recall that the sub-options for the
    several of the main options were grayed out. Tried it again, HELP was
    not active, selected UTILITIES, then Restore Backups, it booted into a
    DOS-based Restore program that showed the two Backup files as Restore
    options, but I did not see anything there that would allow me to
    delete those files, so I got out of there.

    Curious, could I boot into DOS and delete those files?

    Interestingly, I selected the 'Create Diagnostic Disks' option, and it
    took me through creating 5 floppy disks, even thought this machine
    does not have a floppy drive. Guess the utility versions in the
    Predesktop Area are also a little old.

    Sorry to be such a bother. Thanks for sticking with me.

    >
    > --
    > Best regards,    You are cordially invited to participate in the
    > John             official ThinkPad group news:comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad
    Teflon, Oct 21, 2009
    #8
  9. Teflon

    Teflon Guest


    >
    > > >Tried searching the Lenovo site, but all I found was the latest
    > > >version of TV R&R, which you had already pointed me to.  I assumed
    > > >that would not work to get rid of those old IBM RR backup files.

    >
    > > Assumptions, the mother of all screwups.

    >
    > Ain't it the truth.
    >
    > > Try
    > > <http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=MIGR-5...>


    OK, I had found and read that User's Manual before I started asking
    these question, but it unfortunately did not have any advice on how to
    get rid of these files when RR isn't installed, so here I am.

    I also checked the available software downloads for this T41 model,
    but did not see any old versions of IBM Rapid Restore listed. The
    only RR listed was the current 4.21 version. I have no idea what the
    version # was for the utility that came on this machine, but it's got
    to be older than V4.21. Do you think that version would recognize and
    delete those files?

    Thanks.
    Teflon, Oct 21, 2009
    #9
  10. Teflon

    Teflon Guest


    > Install the current version of Rescue and Recovery.
    >


    Downloaded and tried to install RRv4.21, but could not, it said a
    previous version was still installed. Not in Add/Remove Program list,
    not in Program Files. Did another Search for IBM Rapid Restore Ultra,
    but nada. Have no idea where to look.

    Went to DOS, found the \SWTOOLS directory, bore down to the \apps
    \rnr42en directory. The files in that directory appear to be those of
    Rapid Restore, with tvtrnr42_1016.exe possibly being the launch file.

    Not wanting to screw up the registry, I left all of that alone and
    used Disk Management to remove the Service Partition then Partition
    Magic to add that unallocated space to the C: partition. That went
    well and the system is perking right along, so all is fine, with the
    exception of a nag screen on start-up, informing me that R&R could not
    find the Service Partition, and then there's that Single File Recover
    System folder with its two backup files still listed under My
    Computer.

    I can remove R&R from the registry with Reg Seeker, which should solve
    the nag screen problem and hopefully allow me to reinstall R&R, but
    there's still that System folder issue. Apparently, it was not in the
    Service partition, since deleting it did not cause them to go away.

    Still open to advice, suggestions and observations. Hope you're still
    with me. Thanks.
    Teflon, Oct 22, 2009
    #10
  11. Teflon

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:27:49 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > <>:
    >
    >> John Navas wrote:
    >>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    >>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:57:26 -0400, News <> wrote in
    >>> <>:
    >>>
    >>>> John Navas wrote:
    >>>>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    >>>>> On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 20:56:02 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    >>>>> <> wrote in
    >>>>> <>:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>>> Install the current version of Rescue and Recovery.
    >>>>>> Downloaded and tried to install RRv4.21, but could not, it said a
    >>>>>> previous version was still installed. Not in Add/Remove Program
    >>>>>> list, not in Program Files. Did another Search for IBM Rapid
    >>>>>> Restore Ultra, but nada. Have no idea where to look.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Went to DOS, found the \SWTOOLS directory, bore down to the \apps
    >>>>>> \rnr42en directory. The files in that directory appear to be
    >>>>>> those of Rapid Restore, with tvtrnr42_1016.exe possibly being
    >>>>>> the launch file.
    >>>>> That's Rescue and Recovery 3.10.0022.00
    >>>>> Start > Run > "C:\swtools\apps\rnr42en" > press [Enter]
    >>>>> See the .txt file:
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Consideration 8
    >>>>> Rapid Restore Ultra 3.0 and prior versions are not compatible with
    >>>>> the Rescue and Recovery program. If you install the Rescue and
    >>>>> Recovery program and previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra are
    >>>>> installed, then the Rescue and Recovery program prompts you to
    >>>>> uninstall any previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra including
    >>>>> all backups made by prior versions of the program during
    >>>>> installation of the Rescue and Recovery program.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> Not wanting to screw up the registry, I left all of that alone
    >>>>>> and used Disk Management to remove the Service Partition then
    >>>>>> Partition Magic to add that unallocated space to the C:
    >>>>>> partition.
    >>>>> As I've noted before, I think that's a bad idea.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I can remove R&R from the registry with Reg Seeker, which should
    >>>>>> solve the nag screen problem and hopefully allow me to reinstall
    >>>>>> R&R, but there's still that System folder issue. Apparently, it
    >>>>>> was not in the Service partition, since deleting it did not
    >>>>>> cause them to go away.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Still open to advice, suggestions and observations. Hope you're
    >>>>>> still with me. Thanks.
    >>>>> Since you're continuing to thrash around,
    >>>>> I'm not going to help further.
    >>>
    >>>> There's always Acronis.... as previously mentioned.
    >>>
    >>> Irrelevant to the task at hand. Do keep up.

    >>
    >> "Since you're continuing to thrash around, I'm not going to help
    >> further."
    >>
    >> Great vignette for prospective Navas clients. As previously
    >> mentioned.

    >
    > My clients pay me. "Teflon" doeesn't. Big difference.


    So all that you care about is money? Says a lot.

    If you have no intention of helping him further you could simply have ceased
    to reply rather than feeding your ego by making disparaging remarks that
    suggest that your 'help' actually was helpful but ignored. You know, having
    the last word...

    Ego huh? I keep seeing your 'Welcome' posts and your presence here is hard
    to miss but it seems from your comments to Teflon that, when the going gets
    tough, you get going (elsewhere). Nice.
    --
    Shaun.

    "Give a man a fire and he's warm for the day. But set fire to him and he's
    warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchet, 'Jingo'.
    ~misfit~, Oct 23, 2009
    #11
  12. Teflon

    pithydoug Guest

    On Oct 22, 7:57 pm, "~misfit~" <> wrote:
    > Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > > On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:27:49 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > > <>:

    >
    > >> John Navas wrote:
    > >>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > >>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:57:26 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > >>> <>:

    >
    > >>>> John Navas wrote:
    > >>>>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > >>>>> On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 20:56:02 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > >>>>> <> wrote in
    > >>>>> <>:

    >
    > >>>>>>> Install the current version of Rescue and Recovery.
    > >>>>>> Downloaded and tried to install RRv4.21, but could not, it said a
    > >>>>>> previous version was still installed.  Not in Add/Remove Program
    > >>>>>> list, not in Program Files.  Did another Search for IBM Rapid
    > >>>>>> Restore Ultra, but nada.  Have no idea where to look.

    >
    > >>>>>> Went to DOS, found the \SWTOOLS directory, bore down to the \apps
    > >>>>>> \rnr42en directory.  The files in that directory appear to be
    > >>>>>> those of Rapid Restore, with tvtrnr42_1016.exe possibly being
    > >>>>>> the launch file.
    > >>>>> That's Rescue and Recovery 3.10.0022.00
    > >>>>> Start > Run > "C:\swtools\apps\rnr42en" > press [Enter]
    > >>>>> See the .txt file:

    >
    > >>>>> Consideration 8
    > >>>>> Rapid Restore Ultra 3.0 and prior versions are not compatible with
    > >>>>> the Rescue and Recovery program. If you install the Rescue and
    > >>>>> Recovery program and previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra are
    > >>>>> installed, then the Rescue and Recovery program prompts you to
    > >>>>> uninstall any previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra including
    > >>>>> all backups made by prior versions of the program during
    > >>>>> installation of the Rescue and Recovery program.

    >
    > >>>>>> Not wanting to screw up the registry, I left all of that alone
    > >>>>>> and used Disk Management to remove the Service Partition then
    > >>>>>> Partition Magic to add that unallocated space to the C:
    > >>>>>> partition.
    > >>>>> As I've noted before, I think that's a bad idea.

    >
    > >>>>>> I can remove R&R from the registry with Reg Seeker, which should
    > >>>>>> solve the nag screen problem and hopefully allow me to reinstall
    > >>>>>> R&R, but there's still that System folder issue.  Apparently, it
    > >>>>>> was not in the Service partition, since deleting it did not
    > >>>>>> cause them to go away.

    >
    > >>>>>> Still open to advice, suggestions and observations.  Hope you're
    > >>>>>> still with me.  Thanks.
    > >>>>> Since you're continuing to thrash around,
    > >>>>> I'm not going to help further.

    >
    > >>>> There's always Acronis....  as previously mentioned.

    >
    > >>> Irrelevant to the task at hand.  Do keep up.

    >
    > >> "Since you're continuing to thrash around, I'm not going to help
    > >> further."

    >
    > >> Great vignette for prospective Navas clients.  As previously
    > >> mentioned.

    >
    > > My clients pay me.  "Teflon" doeesn't.  Big difference.

    >
    > So all that you care about is money? Says a lot.
    >
    > If you have no intention of helping him further you could simply have ceased
    > to reply rather than feeding your ego by making disparaging  remarks that
    > suggest that your 'help' actually was helpful but ignored. You know, having
    > the last word...



    User: my car is running rough.
    Reply: let's look at the spark plugs and wires first.
    user: I polished the pistons and have a few parts left over.
    Reply: Did you look at plugs and wires?
    User: Transmission has this wire that heads towards the engine. I
    replaced it albeit a a different gauge.
    ..
    ..


    If you ask for help then follow it. If you exhaust all avenues and not
    satisfied then bitch. But jumping into the bowels of the system while
    trying to stay with the externals just adds total confusion.
    pithydoug, Oct 23, 2009
    #12
  13. Teflon

    Teflon Guest


    > Since you're continuing to thrash around,
    > I'm not going to help further.


    You know John, like a lot of folks who use support news groups, if I
    knew exactly what to do, I wouldn't have a need to seek help from news
    groups that purportedly were set up to help those of us who aren't
    experts. There are those newsgroups where immature brats go to dis
    and put others down, but I didn't think this NG was one of them.

    As to your suggestion about factory specs, if this machine's factory
    specs hadn't been polluted by MSFT's 'Live' maintenance service, or
    whatever, I wouldn't be having these problems.

    Fortunately, I did take the advice of one of your watchers (thanks
    NEWS), and made an image of everything with Acronis TI. So, I can put
    it all back the way it was, but for the life of me, I don't know why I
    would want to do that. Since I am now using ATI to back up to an
    external HDD, I sure don't 'need' RnR, and getting rid of that entire
    Service partition freed up a lot of HD space. I can't recall ever
    needing, or using, any of the pre-desktop stuff, most of which now
    seems to be obsolete.

    All I am trying to do now, is to get the rest of that RnR stuff out of
    this PC.

    John, contrary to your apparent preference for ThinkPads, it would
    appear you don't have an IBM background. With an accumulated 80+
    years of IBM service in my family, I can't imagine an IBMer ever
    abandoning someone mid-stream, essentially telling them to shove off.

    I do hope you keep this NG going. I will continue to post my requests
    for assistance. Perhaps a more tolerant ThinkPad expert will happen
    by and answer my question. That said, I do appreciate your effort to
    help, but you can relax now, looks like I'm your only active reader
    today.
    Teflon, Oct 23, 2009
    #13
  14. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 22, 4:57 pm, "~misfit~" <> wrote:
    > Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > > On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:27:49 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > > <>:

    >
    > >> John Navas wrote:
    > >>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > >>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:57:26 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > >>> <>:

    >
    > >>>> John Navas wrote:
    > >>>>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > >>>>> On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 20:56:02 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > >>>>> <> wrote in
    > >>>>> <>:

    >
    > >>>>>>> Install the current version of Rescue and Recovery.
    > >>>>>> Downloaded and tried to install RRv4.21, but could not, it said a
    > >>>>>> previous version was still installed.  Not in Add/Remove Program
    > >>>>>> list, not in Program Files.  Did another Search for IBM Rapid
    > >>>>>> Restore Ultra, but nada.  Have no idea where to look.

    >
    > >>>>>> Went to DOS, found the \SWTOOLS directory, bore down to the \apps
    > >>>>>> \rnr42en directory.  The files in that directory appear to be
    > >>>>>> those of Rapid Restore, with tvtrnr42_1016.exe possibly being
    > >>>>>> the launch file.
    > >>>>> That's Rescue and Recovery 3.10.0022.00
    > >>>>> Start > Run > "C:\swtools\apps\rnr42en" > press [Enter]
    > >>>>> See the .txt file:

    >
    > >>>>> Consideration 8
    > >>>>> Rapid Restore Ultra 3.0 and prior versions are not compatible with
    > >>>>> the Rescue and Recovery program. If you install the Rescue and
    > >>>>> Recovery program and previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra are
    > >>>>> installed, then the Rescue and Recovery program prompts you to
    > >>>>> uninstall any previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra including
    > >>>>> all backups made by prior versions of the program during
    > >>>>> installation of the Rescue and Recovery program.

    >
    > >>>>>> Not wanting to screw up the registry, I left all of that alone
    > >>>>>> and used Disk Management to remove the Service Partition then
    > >>>>>> Partition Magic to add that unallocated space to the C:
    > >>>>>> partition.
    > >>>>> As I've noted before, I think that's a bad idea.

    >
    > >>>>>> I can remove R&R from the registry with Reg Seeker, which should
    > >>>>>> solve the nag screen problem and hopefully allow me to reinstall
    > >>>>>> R&R, but there's still that System folder issue.  Apparently, it
    > >>>>>> was not in the Service partition, since deleting it did not
    > >>>>>> cause them to go away.

    >
    > >>>>>> Still open to advice, suggestions and observations.  Hope you're
    > >>>>>> still with me.  Thanks.
    > >>>>> Since you're continuing to thrash around,
    > >>>>> I'm not going to help further.

    >
    > >>>> There's always Acronis....  as previously mentioned.

    >
    > >>> Irrelevant to the task at hand.  Do keep up.

    >
    > >> "Since you're continuing to thrash around, I'm not going to help
    > >> further."

    >
    > >> Great vignette for prospective Navas clients.  As previously
    > >> mentioned.

    >
    > > My clients pay me.  "Teflon" doeesn't.  Big difference.

    >
    > So all that you care about is money? Says a lot.
    >
    > If you have no intention of helping him further you could simply have ceased
    > to reply rather than feeding your ego by making disparaging  remarks that
    > suggest that your 'help' actually was helpful but ignored. You know, having
    > the last word...
    >
    > Ego huh? I keep seeing your 'Welcome' posts and your presence here is hard
    > to miss but it seems from your comments to Teflon that, when the going gets
    > tough, you get going (elsewhere). Nice.
    > --
    > Shaun.


    Well said Shaun, and a tip of me Tam to you, me lad.
    Teflon, Oct 23, 2009
    #14
  15. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 23, 5:37 am, pithydoug <> wrote:
    > On Oct 22, 7:57 pm, "~misfit~" <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:

    >
    > > > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > > > On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:27:49 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > > > <>:

    >
    > > >> John Navas wrote:
    > > >>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > > >>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:57:26 -0400, News <> wrote in
    > > >>> <>:

    >
    > > >>>> John Navas wrote:
    > > >>>>> [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > > >>>>> On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 20:56:02 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > > >>>>> <> wrote in
    > > >>>>> <>:

    >
    > > >>>>>>> Install the current version of Rescue and Recovery.
    > > >>>>>> Downloaded and tried to install RRv4.21, but could not, it said a
    > > >>>>>> previous version was still installed.  Not in Add/Remove Program
    > > >>>>>> list, not in Program Files.  Did another Search for IBM Rapid
    > > >>>>>> Restore Ultra, but nada.  Have no idea where to look.

    >
    > > >>>>>> Went to DOS, found the \SWTOOLS directory, bore down to the \apps
    > > >>>>>> \rnr42en directory.  The files in that directory appear to be
    > > >>>>>> those of Rapid Restore, with tvtrnr42_1016.exe possibly being
    > > >>>>>> the launch file.
    > > >>>>> That's Rescue and Recovery 3.10.0022.00
    > > >>>>> Start > Run > "C:\swtools\apps\rnr42en" > press [Enter]
    > > >>>>> See the .txt file:

    >
    > > >>>>> Consideration 8
    > > >>>>> Rapid Restore Ultra 3.0 and prior versions are not compatible with
    > > >>>>> the Rescue and Recovery program. If you install the Rescue and
    > > >>>>> Recovery program and previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra are
    > > >>>>> installed, then the Rescue and Recovery program prompts you to
    > > >>>>> uninstall any previous versions of Rapid Restore Ultra including
    > > >>>>> all backups made by prior versions of the program during
    > > >>>>> installation of the Rescue and Recovery program.

    >
    > > >>>>>> Not wanting to screw up the registry, I left all of that alone
    > > >>>>>> and used Disk Management to remove the Service Partition then
    > > >>>>>> Partition Magic to add that unallocated space to the C:
    > > >>>>>> partition.
    > > >>>>> As I've noted before, I think that's a bad idea.

    >
    > > >>>>>> I can remove R&R from the registry with Reg Seeker, which should
    > > >>>>>> solve the nag screen problem and hopefully allow me to reinstall
    > > >>>>>> R&R, but there's still that System folder issue.  Apparently, it
    > > >>>>>> was not in the Service partition, since deleting it did not
    > > >>>>>> cause them to go away.

    >
    > > >>>>>> Still open to advice, suggestions and observations.  Hope you're
    > > >>>>>> still with me.  Thanks.
    > > >>>>> Since you're continuing to thrash around,
    > > >>>>> I'm not going to help further.

    >
    > > >>>> There's always Acronis....  as previously mentioned.

    >
    > > >>> Irrelevant to the task at hand.  Do keep up.

    >
    > > >> "Since you're continuing to thrash around, I'm not going to help
    > > >> further."

    >
    > > >> Great vignette for prospective Navas clients.  As previously
    > > >> mentioned.

    >
    > > > My clients pay me.  "Teflon" doeesn't.  Big difference.

    >
    > > So all that you care about is money? Says a lot.

    >
    > > If you have no intention of helping him further you could simply have ceased
    > > to reply rather than feeding your ego by making disparaging  remarks that
    > > suggest that your 'help' actually was helpful but ignored. You know, having
    > > the last word...

    >
    > User: my car is running rough.
    > Reply: let's look at the spark plugs and wires first.
    > user: I polished the pistons and have a few parts left over.
    > Reply: Did you look at plugs and wires?
    > User: Transmission has this wire that heads towards the engine. I
    > replaced it albeit a a different gauge.
    > .


    Since you seem to be in to analogies, try this one:

    Patient: My tooth hurts, I want it pulled.
    Reply: You don't want to pull any teeth, you need to save teeth, even
    broken teeth. Fill it, I'll show you how.
    Patient: I filled the tooth, per your instructions, but it still
    hurts, I want it pulled.
    Reply: You need to do a root-canal.
    Patient: OK, tell me how.
    Reply: Read this manual
    Patient: Root canal done, still hurt, so I pulled it.
    Reply: Should of put on a crown.
    Patient: That costs lots of money.
    Reply; That's what I'm here for.
    Patient: Can you tell me how to stop the bleeding?
    Reply: What do you think I am, a Dentist?
    Patient: You're not? What is this place?
    Reply; This is ACORN, we just act like we know what we are talking
    about, it's all about the money.
    Patient: You've been very helpful.
    Reply: You've been very disrespectful. I'm not helping you any more.
    NEXT!!!

    I think that is a better depiction of what went on here. This guy
    John is a head case. (That's a pun, folks.) ;-)

    >
    > If you ask for help then follow it. If you exhaust all avenues and not
    > satisfied then bitch. But jumping into the bowels of the system while
    > trying to stay with the externals just adds total confusion.


    BTW, pithydoug, in case no one has pointed this out to you in the
    past, you may have a severe case of Rectilitous.
    Teflon, Oct 23, 2009
    #15
  16. Teflon

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Fri, 23 Oct 2009 07:15:18 -0700 (PDT), Teflon
    > <> wrote in
    > <>:
    >
    >>> Since you're continuing to thrash around,
    >>> I'm not going to help further.

    >>
    >> You know John, like a lot of folks who use support news groups, if I
    >> knew exactly what to do, I wouldn't have a need to seek help from
    >> news groups that purportedly were set up to help those of us who
    >> aren't experts. There are those newsgroups where immature brats go
    >> to dis and put others down, but I didn't think this NG was one of
    >> them.

    >
    > This isn't a "support news group". This is a discussion forum.
    > I'm here to exchange information, not to provide free support.
    > Support is the business of Lenovo. I do sometimes provide free
    > assistance (as a way of giving back), but only when I feel it's
    > worthwhile, and a sure turnoff for me is when people demand support as
    > if I have some sort of obligation to provide it.
    >
    > My rule when providing free assistance in depth is to only help those
    > who are sufficiently appreciative to respect the time I'm investing by
    > following my advice. If you aren't willing to follow advice, then why
    > ask for it in the first place? To be clear, I'm not talking about a
    > simple question, I'm talking about this kind of complex dialog.
    >
    > I care enough about the accuracy of my advice to test it first, which
    > can take considerable time, and don't appreciate having that time
    > wasted. That's why my professional rate for cleaning up messes when
    > someone has ignored my advice is much higher than my standard rate,
    > and why I won't continue providing free assistance when someone
    > ignores or (worse) goes against my advice. You have a right to do
    > that, of course, but then I likewise have a right not to continue.
    >
    >> As to your suggestion about factory specs, if this machine's factory
    >> specs hadn't been polluted by MSFT's 'Live' maintenance service, or
    >> whatever, I wouldn't be having these problems.

    >
    > Assumptions, the mother of all screwups. I seriously doubt that was
    > the problem. I think cockpit error is the more likely cause.
    >
    >> Fortunately, I did take the advice of one of your watchers (thanks

    >
    > Not mine.
    >
    >> NEWS), and made an image of everything with Acronis TI. So, I can
    >> put it all back the way it was, but for the life of me, I don't know
    >> why I would want to do that. Since I am now using ATI to back up to
    >> an external HDD, I sure don't 'need' RnR, and getting rid of that
    >> entire Service partition freed up a lot of HD space. I can't recall
    >> ever needing, or using, any of the pre-desktop stuff, most of which
    >> now seems to be obsolete.

    >
    > Assumptions, the mother of all screwups. You don't know the reasons
    > because you lack experience and expertise. It's a bit like saying,
    > "How can I put diesel into the gas tank of my car?" and not listening
    > when someone tells you how to do it but advises you not to.
    >
    >> All I am trying to do now, is to get the rest of that RnR stuff out
    >> of this PC.

    >
    > Good luck. You're going about it the wrong way, so you'll need it.
    >
    >> John, contrary to your apparent preference for ThinkPads, it would
    >> appear you don't have an IBM background. With an accumulated 80+
    >> years of IBM service in my family, I can't imagine an IBMer ever
    >> abandoning someone mid-stream, essentially telling them to shove off.

    >
    > Assumptions, the mother of all screwups. You have no knowledge of my
    > background, but I'm not an IBMer, and I have no obligation whatsoever
    > to help anyone, much less someone so disrespectful.
    >
    >> I do hope you keep this NG going. I will continue to post my
    >> requests for assistance. Perhaps a more tolerant ThinkPad expert
    >> will happen by and answer my question. That said, I do appreciate
    >> your effort to help, but you can relax now, looks like I'm your only
    >> active reader today.

    >
    > This newsgroup is on autopilot and life support. I just started it,
    > and Usenet is dying, thanks is part to your kind of attitude.


    LOL! He posts upteen posts and you say that he's part of the reason for the
    pending death of usenet? Before Teflon started posting to this group it
    would go weeks with only a post or two, if that.
    --
    Shaun.

    "Give a man a fire and he's warm for the day. But set fire to him and he's
    warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchet, 'Jingo'.
    ~misfit~, Oct 23, 2009
    #16
  17. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 23, 2:31 pm, "~misfit~" <> wrote:
    > Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:
    >
    > > This newsgroup is on autopilot and life support.  I just started it,
    > > and Usenet is dying, thanks is part to your kind of attitude.

    >
    > LOL! He posts upteen posts and you say that he's part of the reason for the
    > pending death of usenet? Before Teflon started posting to this group it
    > would go weeks with only a post or two, if that.
    > --
    > Shaun.


    Hey Shaun, I was relieved to see there are at least two other readers
    of this NG, besides myself, who don't have their heads shoved where
    the sun doesn't shine. Obviously, John and that pissydoug character
    aren't in that select group.

    I really should apologize to John. It was rude of me to continue
    seeking advice after I recognized early on that the complexity of my
    problem was exceeding the scope of his expertise. I was hoping there
    were other, more experienced readers that could weigh in and help me
    get to a solution. I didn't realize John considered this NG to be his
    own private little sandbox. Obviously, John's hissy-fit had more to
    do with having his ineptness exposed, than it did with anything I
    asked or did. So childish

    BTW, I solved the problem, got rid of the folder and my wife says with
    the added 11 GB's, her system runs better than ever. Probably gave
    the swap file room to grow. Whatever, I am a hero, for awhile. Off
    to find a NG where the folks are friendlier, and the advice is worthy
    of my questions. Take care.
    Teflon, Oct 24, 2009
    #17
  18. Teflon

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs Teflon wrote:
    > On Oct 23, 2:31 pm, "~misfit~" <> wrote:
    >> Somewhere on teh intarwebs John Navas wrote:
    >>
    >>> This newsgroup is on autopilot and life support. I just started it,
    >>> and Usenet is dying, thanks is part to your kind of attitude.

    >>
    >> LOL! He posts upteen posts and you say that he's part of the reason
    >> for the pending death of usenet? Before Teflon started posting to
    >> this group it would go weeks with only a post or two, if that.

    >
    > Hey Shaun, I was relieved to see there are at least two other readers
    > of this NG, besides myself, who don't have their heads shoved where
    > the sun doesn't shine. Obviously, John and that pissydoug character
    > aren't in that select group.
    >
    > I really should apologize to John. It was rude of me to continue
    > seeking advice after I recognized early on that the complexity of my
    > problem was exceeding the scope of his expertise. I was hoping there
    > were other, more experienced readers that could weigh in and help me
    > get to a solution. I didn't realize John considered this NG to be his
    > own private little sandbox. Obviously, John's hissy-fit had more to
    > do with having his ineptness exposed, than it did with anything I
    > asked or did. So childish
    >
    > BTW, I solved the problem, got rid of the folder and my wife says with
    > the added 11 GB's, her system runs better than ever. Probably gave
    > the swap file room to grow. Whatever, I am a hero, for awhile. Off
    > to find a NG where the folks are friendlier, and the advice is worthy
    > of my questions. Take care.


    Pleased to hear that you solved the problem. I didn't know how so kept my
    mouth shut. I'm more hardware.

    You run a swapfile? It's an R51 right? My R51 has 2GB of RAM, XP Pro sp3 and
    no swapfile and runs sweet as a nut [and fast].

    Cheers,
    --
    Shaun.

    "Give a man a fire and he's warm for the day. But set fire to him and he's
    warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchet, 'Jingo'.
    ~misfit~, Oct 24, 2009
    #18
  19. Teflon

    Teflon Guest


    > Pleased to hear that you solved the problem. I didn't know how so kept my
    > mouth shut. I'm more hardware.


    I've been a problem solver all my life. Used to be an IBM SE /
    programmer before I determined I was doing most of the work, but the
    sales guys were making the big bucks. I switched to sales. Whenever
    I have a problem to solve, I always pick the brains of at least 3
    knowledgeable persons before I do anything new. When I get 2 that
    agree, I dig further before giving their suggestions a try. Been down
    too many dead-ends taking the advice of one 'expert' that didn't know
    squat. It was actually a young girl in one forum and a guy in another
    that suggested the process that worked. Some very bright kids out
    there - scary.

    > You run a swapfile? It's an R51 right? My R51 has 2GB of RAM, XP Pro sp3 and
    > no swapfile and runs sweet as a nut [and fast].


    Yes, my system is an R51, the one I was 'fixing' is a T41. Both have
    556 MB of RAM. Running XP Pro with 556MB, you run a swap file. Have
    an older i1400 series TP with 96MB RAM and a 4GB HD running 98SE.
    Solved the need for additional data storage by adding a 16GB USB flash
    drive. Have it monitoring/swapping in a P2P group, and it just keeps
    running, it is a jewel. When the Windows 7 early-adopters buying
    frenzy dies down, I'll probably get something new, and you can bet it
    will have a lot of RAM.

    Pardon the 'selective posting', but most of the popular forums demand
    that. Who wants to read a thread with every post repeating everything
    previously posted. Select and respond to only that which is germain,
    cut the rest. If someone really want to read the original post, all
    they have to do is scan up the thread.
    Teflon, Oct 24, 2009
    #19
  20. Teflon

    Teflon Guest

    On Oct 24, 9:39 am, John Navas <> wrote:
    > [Follow-up set to comp.sys.laptops.thinkpad]
    > On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 22:00:06 +1300, "~misfit~"
    > <> wrote in
    > <hbufmr$-september.org>:
    >
    > >You run a swapfile? It's an R51 right? My R51 has 2GB of RAM, XP Pro sp3and
    > >no swapfile and runs sweet as a nut [and fast].

    >
    > FYI, that's a bad idea, as Microsoft states -- because of the way
    > Windows is programmed, that can cause unexpected slowdowns and other
    > mysterious problems.  Better to set a small pagefile (not swapfile --
    > different technology), and with 2GB of RAM, a pagefile size of 512-1024
    > MB will set the minimum Windows needs for best efficiency, plus enough
    > expansion to prevent problems due to running out of pagefile space.



    Excuuuuuuuuse me, I don't recall there being any request made for
    technical advice. You just don't get it, do you John. Like bad
    breath, your condescending attitude doesn't cut it.
    Teflon, Oct 25, 2009
    #20
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