Is NAV necessary in Mac OSX Tiger?

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Bible John, Jun 1, 2005.

  1. Bible John

    Bible John Guest

    I will have to repurchase NAV, or do I need it? Yes I use MS Office,
    and no I do not normally download files from the Internet and open them
    in Word.



    John

    --
    http://johnw.freeshell.org/bible/
     
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  2. In article <>, Bible
    John <> wrote:

    > I will have to repurchase NAV, or do I need it?


    You probably don't need any antivirus software at this point. If you
    decide to buy some, I wouldn't buy NAV; it is only partially compatible
    with Tiger and no update has been announced.

    --
    Jerry Kindall, Seattle, WA <http://www.jerrykindall.com/>

    Send only plain text messages under 32K to the Reply-To address.
    This mailbox is filtered aggressively to thwart spam and viruses.
     
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  3. In article <010620050830591977%>,
    Jerry Kindall <> wrote:

    > In article <>, Bible
    > John <> wrote:
    >
    > > I will have to repurchase NAV, or do I need it?

    >
    > You probably don't need any antivirus software at this point. If you
    > decide to buy some, I wouldn't buy NAV; it is only partially compatible
    > with Tiger and no update has been announced.


    Are there any av's compatible with Tiger out yet?
     
  4. Tim Murray

    Tim Murray Guest

    On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 12:48:31 -0400, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    >
    > Are there any av's compatible with Tiger out yet?


    Yes, see http://www.clamxav.com/
     
  5. In article <>,
    Tim Murray <> wrote:

    > On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 12:48:31 -0400, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    > >
    > > Are there any av's compatible with Tiger out yet?

    >
    > Yes, see http://www.clamxav.com/


    Thanks, I'll look at it tonight.

    Right now, the site isn't loading too fast.....
     
  6. Charles

    Charles Guest

    In article <>,
    Tacit <> wrote:

    > And people pay MONEY--real money, for "protection" from a nonexistent
    > threat--for this!


    Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the threat
    is nonexistant.

    --
    Charles
     
  7. Tim Murray

    Tim Murray Guest

    On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 17:30:34 -0400, Charles wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Tacit <> wrote:
    >
    >> And people pay MONEY--real money, for "protection" from a nonexistent
    >> threat--for this!

    >
    > Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the threat
    > is nonexistant.


    Indeed. Some kid with zits, a pizza, a Jolt cola, and no chance at ever
    having sex with another human being, is working on one as we speak (or so the
    saying goes).
     
  8. In article <010620051730344365%>,
    Charles <> wrote:

    > Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the threat
    > is nonexistant.


    He believes in closing the barn door after the horse has left. The rest
    of us try closing it BEFORE.

    --
    Though I've tried, I've fallen... / I have sunk so low
    I have messed up / Better I should know
     
  9. Ed Anson

    Ed Anson Guest

    Howard S Shubs wrote:
    > In article <010620051730344365%>,
    > Charles <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the threat
    >>is nonexistant.

    >
    >
    > He believes in closing the barn door after the horse has left. The rest
    > of us try closing it BEFORE.


    The problem is that antivirus software tends to require adaptation to
    each virus. IOW you need to update your software as each virus appears.
    In the case of Mac OS X, you need to obtain your software after the
    first virus appears. NAV will be no protection against a virus that
    doesn't exist yet. But it can cause worse damage than most viruses do. I
    ripped NAV out of my system ages ago.
     
  10. In article <>,
    Ed Anson <> wrote:

    > The problem is that antivirus software tends to require adaptation to
    > each virus. IOW you need to update your software as each virus appears.


    In general, viruses do not spontaneously appear everywhere at once. If
    you're updating your virusdefs at least daily, you should be fine. Now,
    NAV is another issue. I'd not buy anything from Symantec, period.

    --
    Though I've tried, I've fallen... / I have sunk so low
    I have messed up / Better I should know
     
  11. Ed Anson

    Ed Anson Guest

    phish wrote:
    > On 2005-06-01 18:31:33 -0700, Ed Anson <> said:
    >
    >> Howard S Shubs wrote:
    >>
    >>> In article <010620051730344365%>,
    >>> Charles <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the threat
    >>>> is nonexistant.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> He believes in closing the barn door after the horse has left. The
    >>> rest of us try closing it BEFORE.

    >>
    >>
    >> The problem is that antivirus software tends to require adaptation to
    >> each virus. IOW you need to update your software as each virus
    >> appears. In the case of Mac OS X, you need to obtain your software
    >> after the first virus appears. NAV will be no protection against a
    >> virus that doesn't exist yet. But it can cause worse damage than most
    >> viruses do. I ripped NAV out of my system ages ago.

    >
    >
    > I don't want to start a flame war here, and I'm not a programmer, so I
    > can't talk about how well the code is written, all I can do is share my
    > own experience with NAV which I've used on the Mac since Mac OS 9.2, and
    > I've never had problems with it. I currently run NAV 10 on Tiger 10.4.1
    > and everything runs smoothly -- in fact, it seems they've made
    > improvements to NAV 10, since it no longer seems to slow down my system
    > (as did 9.0.2 in Panther).


    You're lucky. It caused serious problems for me, to the point that I had
    to remove it to get anything done.

    >
    > The issue (at this point) is not whether there are viruses on the Mac --
    > the issue is that if you are exchanging files with Windows users it's
    > common courtesy (for those who care) to run an anti-virus software, jsut
    > so you don't accidentally become the host of a virus and pass it on to
    > an unassuming Windows user.


    That's a valid point. And if there were a reasonable way to protect
    against that kind of thing, I'd check it out. But then, I don't exchange
    a lot of files, so I have higher priorities. NAV is simply not an option
    for me.

    >
    > Anyway, I;'ve never had problems with NAV, no do I know peers who have
    > (and I'm not a Symantec fan -- on the contrary, if there were a
    > reasonable alternative out there, I'd take it, since Symantec's customer
    > support for the Mac and update policy sucks).
    >
     
  12. Roy Smith

    Roy Smith Guest

    Tacit <> wrote:
    > virus-writing is claimed by some people to be the top income source
    > for Russian organized crime, surpassing the old-economy trifecta of
    > prostitution, drugs, and protection rackets.


    Actually, in a way, it is a protection racket. The standard
    protection racket runs something like: "If you don't pay me $X/week,
    we'll burn your house down".

    The new protection racket goes: "If you don't buy my anti-virus
    software, they'll infect your computer".

    The only difference is that in the old way, the same guys were working
    both sides of the street. In the new incarnation, the virus writers
    and the virus protection writers are (to the best of my knowledge),
    different people, but it's a bit of a symbiotic relationship.

    The Nortons and McAfees of the world depend on the bad guys to keep
    them in business; there's no money to be made in protection if the
    protection folks do their job *too* well and drive the bad guys
    completely out of business. Imagine if they discovered a way that was
    so effective at eradicating computer viruses that virus-writing became
    unprofitiable. What would they do with it?

    Imagine the tempation for the anti-virus companies to also be in the
    virus-writing business themselves. There's lots of money to be made
    being the first guy to discover a cure for the latest killer disease.
     
  13. David Magda

    David Magda Guest

    Charles <> writes:

    > Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the
    > threat is nonexistant.


    True.

    However, anti-virus is a bit like insurance: you're paying for a
    service in case something bad happens. If a virus or worm goes after
    your PC then the cost of the anti-virus will probably be worth it.

    Given that there are no know viruses or worms targeted for OS X in the
    wild, is the premium of A/V software worth it? For some people yes,
    for others no.

    I've used the analogy of having someone in Florida not paying for
    earth quake insurance, but getting hurricane protection. Vice versa
    for someone on Califorinia.

    Personally, I don't have any A/V software on either my one or my
    sister's Mac. At some point it may be necessary, but not now.

    --
    David Magda <dmagda at ee.ryerson.ca>
    Because the innovator has for enemies all those who have done well under
    the old conditions, and lukewarm defenders in those who may do well
    under the new. -- Niccolo Machiavelli, _The Prince_, Chapter VI
     
  14. David Magda

    David Magda Guest

    Tacit <> writes:

    > However, it DOES mean that antivirus software is useless.
    >
    > You see, an antivirus program can only protect against viruses that
    > it knows about. It cannot protect against viruses it does not know
    > about.


    There are heuristics. Have no idea how good they are though.

    --
    David Magda <dmagda at ee.ryerson.ca>
    Because the innovator has for enemies all those who have done well under
    the old conditions, and lukewarm defenders in those who may do well
    under the new. -- Niccolo Machiavelli, _The Prince_, Chapter VI
     
  15. Tim Murray

    Tim Murray Guest

    On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 10:51:21 -0400, Bible John wrote:
    > I will have to repurchase NAV, or do I need it? Yes I use MS Office,
    > and no I do not normally download files from the Internet and open them
    > in Word.


    I went with ClamXAV (http://www.clamxav.com/) because it satisfies my need to
    scan on demand, such as some e-mail attachments, and it does not need to run
    in the background.
     
  16. Ilgaz Ocal

    Ilgaz Ocal Guest

    On 2005-06-01 19:48:31 +0300, Lloyd Parsons <> said:

    > In article <010620050830591977%>,
    > Jerry Kindall <> wrote:
    >
    >> In article <>, Bible
    >> John <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> I will have to repurchase NAV, or do I need it?

    >>
    >> You probably don't need any antivirus software at this point. If you
    >> decide to buy some, I wouldn't buy NAV; it is only partially compatible
    >> with Tiger and no update has been announced.

    >
    > Are there any av's compatible with Tiger out yet?


    My Intego virusbarrier works just fine, in fact it even uses the
    spotlight advantages.

    Ilgaz
     
  17. In article <>,
    Tacit <> wrote:

    > On the Mac, since there are no known viruses, there are no known
    > infection vectors; heuristics are likely to be useless, as there is no
    > data to provide patterns of behavior characteristic of viruses. How do
    > you define "virus-like activity" if there are no viruses whose activity
    > you can study?


    Tacit-

    When you say "no known viruses", does that mean they have all been
    eradicated and now are extinct?

    It was almost 20 years ago that someone brought in a game disk and
    infected the Mac Plus where I worked. A popular program at the time was
    Disinfectant, which was able to remove the infection.

    That was pre-OS 7, but I can't believe there aren't any that affect OS X.
    NAV does manage to come out with an update every month or so. Are you
    saying NAV for Macintosh is a fraud?

    Check out http://www.icsalabs.com/html/communities/antivirus/macvirus.shtml.

    Fred
     
  18. In article <010620051730344365%>,
    Charles <> wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > Tacit <> wrote:
    >
    > > And people pay MONEY--real money, for "protection" from a nonexistent
    > > threat--for this!

    >
    > Just because there are no viruses at this time does not mean the threat
    > is nonexistant.


    That is a pure FUD statement. People should not be spending money (or
    time) chasing down ghosts. If and when viruses that can spread on *nix
    systems show up, then go ahead and take action.
     
  19. Charles

    Charles Guest

    In article <>, Carl
    Witthoft <> wrote:

    > That is a pure FUD statement. People should not be spending money (or
    > time) chasing down ghosts. If and when viruses that can spread on *nix
    > systems show up, then go ahead and take action.


    You don't think OS X could ever become a target for malicious hackers?
    As OS X becomes more popular it will become a more inviting target. And
    there have been vulnerabilities. That is why there have been security
    updates.

    As far as spending money on virus protection---I would not spend money
    on it either. But not because the threat is nonexistant. It could
    happen. I would not spend money on virus protection because in my
    opinion there isn't any existant product worth spending money on.

    --
    Charles
     
  20. In article <030620051718033471%>, Charles
    <> wrote:

    > In article <>, Carl
    > Witthoft <> wrote:
    >
    > > That is a pure FUD statement. People should not be spending money (or
    > > time) chasing down ghosts. If and when viruses that can spread on *nix
    > > systems show up, then go ahead and take action.

    >
    > You don't think OS X could ever become a target for malicious hackers?


    Of course it could, and most likely will. What he's saying is, when
    that happens, buy antivirus software.

    --
    Jerry Kindall, Seattle, WA <http://www.jerrykindall.com/>

    Send only plain text messages under 32K to the Reply-To address.
    This mailbox is filtered aggressively to thwart spam and viruses.
     
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