JE4333APM issues

Discussion in 'FIC' started by Tim, Oct 9, 2003.

  1. Tim

    Tim Guest

    Based on experience and lessons gained from fielding three dozen (or
    more) emails over the past two years helping individuals find
    work-arounds to various problems or questions arising from the use of
    JE4333APM, I offer the following (unsolicited) observations:

    The majority of issues stem from (often unexplainable) resource
    conflicts (I/O, IRQ, etc) associated with changing the BIOS while
    attempting to preserve a current hardware and OS configuration. I
    believe most could have been avoided had users followed my
    recommendation to reinstall the OS and drivers after updating the
    BIOS, but many apparently thought I was just saying this for my
    health.

    For these problems, there are two solutions that seem to work in 90+%
    of all cases.

    Solution #1:

    - Install the Chipset INF and, more importantly, the IRQ
    Miniport/Routing driver from an earlier version of the VIA 4-in-1
    Driver (such as v4.35~v4.38), even if the OS is 'supposed' to have the
    IRQ Routing patch for VIA chipsets (including Win98SE and ME). Even
    if you already installed it prior to the BIOS upgrade, install it
    again. The 4-in-1 setup should detect the OS then give a choice of
    drivers that are recommended. The VIA ATAPI Vendor Support Driver is
    NOT required for the vast majority of configurations. There is no
    point in using more recent versions of the 4-in-1 on any flavor of
    Win9x since they offer nothing for these older platforms and may
    actually cause more problems

    - Enter BIOS SETUP and set Reset Configuration Data under PNP/PCI
    Configuration to "Enable", Save and Exit

    - Boot to Windows normally, check for new resource conflicts or device
    problems in Device Manager. If all is well, test the system to see if
    anything "magical" happened (and it has been described as "magical"
    when it works - lol!)


    Solution #2 (assuming #1 was tried without success):

    - Pull every non-essential PCI/ISA card (audio, modem, NIC, etc) and
    uninstall their drivers (restarting as prompted)

    - Enter BIOS SETUP and set Reset Configuration Data under PNP/PCI
    Configuration to "Enable", Save and Exit

    - Re-install cards and latest drivers one at a time, testing each
    thoroughly for proper function before installing another

    - If a problem crops-up after installing a certain PCI/ISA card, you
    know where the problem was. I've seen this several different times, a
    particular card simply does not like a particular slot for no apparent
    reason and it will even cause other devices to balk at the
    arrangement. Underlying cause is likely a PCI bus arbitration, bus
    parking, or IRQ sharing conflict, may or may not be resolved by
    disabling/enabling PCI2.1 compliance features such as PCI Delayed
    Transaction. Try swapping slots with another card


    Other observations and senseless rambling:

    JE4333 (and thus JE4333APM) appear to support HDD capacities up to
    80GB and perhaps larger. There should be no BIOS limitation between
    32GB and 100GB+ that wasn't already addressed excepting some
    idiosynchracy with a particular make and model of HDD. Theoretically,
    JE4333 should be good up to the hardware ATA/IDE limitation (~137GB).
    YMMV. If not, there's always the option of an add-in IDE Controller
    PCI card with its own BIOS.

    There is an incompatibility between older versions of Microsoft's
    FDISK and hard drives with capacities larger than 64GB. A new version
    of FDISK can be downloaded from Microsoft through KB article Q263044.
    For potential problems using FDISK to partition hard drives larger
    than 128GB, see KB article Q327202.

    JE4333APM seems to work fine with Windows XPSP1. However, changing
    from an ACPI mode configuration to a non-ACPI BIOS is obviously going
    to conflict with the HAL utilized by XP. Again, installing the OS
    after updating the BIOS would avoid this problem because Setup should
    detect the BIOS as non-ACPI, preventing XP from installing in ACPI
    mode.

    You can ensure ACPI mode is not installed by pressing F5 during XP
    Setup when it prompts the user to press F6 for installing third-party
    SCSI drivers, then selecting "Standard PC" from the Computer/HAL menu.
    I've also read that pressing F7 when prompted by XP Setup to press F6
    will accomplish the same result, preventing Setup from installing in
    ACPI mode.

    To determine if your system was installed without ACPI enabled, right
    click "My Computer" then click Properties > Hardware > Device Manager.
    Expand the entry called "Computer". If the entry is "Standard PC"
    then XP was not installed in ACPI mode. If it reads "Advanced
    Configuration and Power Interface (ACPI) PC", some people have
    reported being able to successfully change this mode to Standard PC
    without reinstalling XP, but I've never done it, and doing so carries
    some risk, so I'm not going to discuss it any further.

    Never install an OS with the full compliment of devices and
    peripherals unless you're restoring an image of a known-working system
    configuration. Always install an OS on a minimalist configuration (no
    audio, modem, NIC, printer, scanner, etc.), then add your optional
    devices and peripherals after the OS is up and running with the latest
    chipset/device support. Many, many, problems can be avoided.

    I now return you to your regularly scheduled insanity. Hope some will
    find this helpful.

    Regards,

    Tim
    Tim, Oct 9, 2003
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Tim

    Robert Akins Guest

    Good advice for anyone, Tim. Thanks for your efforts.
    Robert
    "Tim" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Based on experience and lessons gained from fielding three dozen (or
    > more) emails over the past two years helping individuals find
    > work-arounds to various problems or questions arising from the use of
    > JE4333APM, I offer the following (unsolicited) observations:
    >
    > The majority of issues stem from (often unexplainable) resource
    > conflicts (I/O, IRQ, etc) associated with changing the BIOS while
    > attempting to preserve a current hardware and OS configuration. I
    > believe most could have been avoided had users followed my
    > recommendation to reinstall the OS and drivers after updating the
    > BIOS, but many apparently thought I was just saying this for my
    > health.
    >
    > For these problems, there are two solutions that seem to work in 90+%
    > of all cases.
    >
    > Solution #1:
    >
    > - Install the Chipset INF and, more importantly, the IRQ
    > Miniport/Routing driver from an earlier version of the VIA 4-in-1
    > Driver (such as v4.35~v4.38), even if the OS is 'supposed' to have the
    > IRQ Routing patch for VIA chipsets (including Win98SE and ME). Even
    > if you already installed it prior to the BIOS upgrade, install it
    > again. The 4-in-1 setup should detect the OS then give a choice of
    > drivers that are recommended. The VIA ATAPI Vendor Support Driver is
    > NOT required for the vast majority of configurations. There is no
    > point in using more recent versions of the 4-in-1 on any flavor of
    > Win9x since they offer nothing for these older platforms and may
    > actually cause more problems
    >
    > - Enter BIOS SETUP and set Reset Configuration Data under PNP/PCI
    > Configuration to "Enable", Save and Exit
    >
    > - Boot to Windows normally, check for new resource conflicts or device
    > problems in Device Manager. If all is well, test the system to see if
    > anything "magical" happened (and it has been described as "magical"
    > when it works - lol!)
    >
    >
    > Solution #2 (assuming #1 was tried without success):
    >
    > - Pull every non-essential PCI/ISA card (audio, modem, NIC, etc) and
    > uninstall their drivers (restarting as prompted)
    >
    > - Enter BIOS SETUP and set Reset Configuration Data under PNP/PCI
    > Configuration to "Enable", Save and Exit
    >
    > - Re-install cards and latest drivers one at a time, testing each
    > thoroughly for proper function before installing another
    >
    > - If a problem crops-up after installing a certain PCI/ISA card, you
    > know where the problem was. I've seen this several different times, a
    > particular card simply does not like a particular slot for no apparent
    > reason and it will even cause other devices to balk at the
    > arrangement. Underlying cause is likely a PCI bus arbitration, bus
    > parking, or IRQ sharing conflict, may or may not be resolved by
    > disabling/enabling PCI2.1 compliance features such as PCI Delayed
    > Transaction. Try swapping slots with another card
    >
    >
    > Other observations and senseless rambling:
    >
    > JE4333 (and thus JE4333APM) appear to support HDD capacities up to
    > 80GB and perhaps larger. There should be no BIOS limitation between
    > 32GB and 100GB+ that wasn't already addressed excepting some
    > idiosynchracy with a particular make and model of HDD. Theoretically,
    > JE4333 should be good up to the hardware ATA/IDE limitation (~137GB).
    > YMMV. If not, there's always the option of an add-in IDE Controller
    > PCI card with its own BIOS.
    >
    > There is an incompatibility between older versions of Microsoft's
    > FDISK and hard drives with capacities larger than 64GB. A new version
    > of FDISK can be downloaded from Microsoft through KB article Q263044.
    > For potential problems using FDISK to partition hard drives larger
    > than 128GB, see KB article Q327202.
    >
    > JE4333APM seems to work fine with Windows XPSP1. However, changing
    > from an ACPI mode configuration to a non-ACPI BIOS is obviously going
    > to conflict with the HAL utilized by XP. Again, installing the OS
    > after updating the BIOS would avoid this problem because Setup should
    > detect the BIOS as non-ACPI, preventing XP from installing in ACPI
    > mode.
    >
    > You can ensure ACPI mode is not installed by pressing F5 during XP
    > Setup when it prompts the user to press F6 for installing third-party
    > SCSI drivers, then selecting "Standard PC" from the Computer/HAL menu.
    > I've also read that pressing F7 when prompted by XP Setup to press F6
    > will accomplish the same result, preventing Setup from installing in
    > ACPI mode.
    >
    > To determine if your system was installed without ACPI enabled, right
    > click "My Computer" then click Properties > Hardware > Device Manager.
    > Expand the entry called "Computer". If the entry is "Standard PC"
    > then XP was not installed in ACPI mode. If it reads "Advanced
    > Configuration and Power Interface (ACPI) PC", some people have
    > reported being able to successfully change this mode to Standard PC
    > without reinstalling XP, but I've never done it, and doing so carries
    > some risk, so I'm not going to discuss it any further.
    >
    > Never install an OS with the full compliment of devices and
    > peripherals unless you're restoring an image of a known-working system
    > configuration. Always install an OS on a minimalist configuration (no
    > audio, modem, NIC, printer, scanner, etc.), then add your optional
    > devices and peripherals after the OS is up and running with the latest
    > chipset/device support. Many, many, problems can be avoided.
    >
    > I now return you to your regularly scheduled insanity. Hope some will
    > find this helpful.
    >
    > Regards,
    >
    > Tim
    Robert Akins, Oct 10, 2003
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Tim

    Tim Guest

    (Tim) wrote in message news:<>...

    > Based on experience and lessons gained from fielding three dozen (or
    > more) emails over the past two years helping individuals find
    > work-arounds to various problems or questions arising from the use of
    > JE4333APM, I offer the following (unsolicited) observations:


    Oh yes, one more thing. For goodness sakes, chuck that buggy old MVP3
    board in the scrap heap where it belongs and spend a few bucks for a
    new mainboard, CPU, and ATX case (if you can). There are feature rich
    AthlonXP-ready boards such as the KT2 Combo-L (MS-6764) from MSI that
    offer both SDRAM and DDR-RAM slots to permit the use of existing
    PC100/PC133 SDRAM.

    www.msicomputer.com/product/detail_spec/product_detail.asp?model=KT2_Combo-L

    The MSI KT2 Combo-L uses the rock-solid and mature VIA KT266A/VT8235
    chipset, certified for AthlonXP up to 2600+ (or Duron up to 1.3G),
    accepts just about any type of SDRAM you throw at it (low/high
    density), features USB2.0, 6-channel Audio, LAN, 6 PCI and 1 AGP 2.0
    slot, supports UDMA/133, etc.

    As of this writing, $134.00 will fetch a MSI KT2 Combo-L mainboard,
    1.3GHz Boxed Duron w/HSF, and an El-Cheapo (FoxConn) ATX Case with
    350W ATX2.03 PS from Newegg.com delivered (plus sales tax, if
    applicable). Use your existing SDRAM, HDD, FDD, CD/CDRW/DVD, VGA card
    (play 3D games without crashing), upgrade to DDR-RAM and AthlonXP at
    your leisure, leave Super [Buggy] 7 in the dust. Can't beat it! ;-)

    Regards,

    Tim
    Tim, Oct 10, 2003
    #3
  4. Tim

    Roger Hunt Guest

    In article <>, Tim
    <> writes
    > (Tim) wrote in message news:<47a7af07.0310090445.31972e2e@po
    >s
    >ting.google.com>...

    (snip)
    >
    >Oh yes, one more thing. For goodness sakes, chuck that buggy old MVP3
    >board in the scrap heap where it belongs and spend a few bucks for a
    >new mainboard, CPU, and ATX case (if you can). There are feature rich
    >AthlonXP-ready boards such as the KT2 Combo-L (MS-6764) from MSI that
    >offer both SDRAM and DDR-RAM slots to permit the use of existing
    >PC100/PC133 SDRAM.
    >
    >www.msicomputer.com/product/detail_spec/product_detail.asp?model=KT2_Combo-L
    >
    >The MSI KT2 Combo-L uses the rock-solid and mature VIA KT266A/VT8235
    >chipset, certified for AthlonXP up to 2600+ (or Duron up to 1.3G),
    >accepts just about any type of SDRAM you throw at it (low/high
    >density), features USB2.0, 6-channel Audio, LAN, 6 PCI and 1 AGP 2.0
    >slot, supports UDMA/133, etc.

    (sn)
    >

    Wow! Does it take SIMMS? How many ISA slots? ;-)
    --
    Roger Hunt
    Seriously tempted to upgrade
    Roger Hunt, Oct 10, 2003
    #4
  5. Tim

    Kyle Brant Guest

    Or try out a k7s5a or k7s5a PRO from ECS, very decent and cheap board,
    uses SIS735 chipset (faster than kt266a chipset in bandwidth) accepts
    both pc133 and DDR memory, goes up to xp2600. Lots of support for the
    board also at a very popular web site.

    As for the old SS7 boards, I still run 4 of em, hehe, but I do my
    gaming on my k7s5a 1400 tbird machine.

    --
    Best regards,
    Kyle
    tired of spam, no email address
    "Tim" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    | (Tim) wrote in message
    news:<>...
    |
    | > Based on experience and lessons gained from fielding three dozen
    (or
    | > more) emails over the past two years helping individuals find
    | > work-arounds to various problems or questions arising from the use
    of
    | > JE4333APM, I offer the following (unsolicited) observations:
    |
    | Oh yes, one more thing. For goodness sakes, chuck that buggy old
    MVP3
    | board in the scrap heap where it belongs and spend a few bucks for a
    | new mainboard, CPU, and ATX case (if you can). There are feature
    rich
    | AthlonXP-ready boards such as the KT2 Combo-L (MS-6764) from MSI
    that
    | offer both SDRAM and DDR-RAM slots to permit the use of existing
    | PC100/PC133 SDRAM.
    |
    |
    www.msicomputer.com/product/detail_spec/product_detail.asp?model=KT2_C
    ombo-L
    |
    | The MSI KT2 Combo-L uses the rock-solid and mature VIA KT266A/VT8235
    | chipset, certified for AthlonXP up to 2600+ (or Duron up to 1.3G),
    | accepts just about any type of SDRAM you throw at it (low/high
    | density), features USB2.0, 6-channel Audio, LAN, 6 PCI and 1 AGP 2.0
    | slot, supports UDMA/133, etc.
    |
    | As of this writing, $134.00 will fetch a MSI KT2 Combo-L mainboard,
    | 1.3GHz Boxed Duron w/HSF, and an El-Cheapo (FoxConn) ATX Case with
    | 350W ATX2.03 PS from Newegg.com delivered (plus sales tax, if
    | applicable). Use your existing SDRAM, HDD, FDD, CD/CDRW/DVD, VGA
    card
    | (play 3D games without crashing), upgrade to DDR-RAM and AthlonXP at
    | your leisure, leave Super [Buggy] 7 in the dust. Can't beat it!
    ;-)
    |
    | Regards,
    |
    | Tim
    Kyle Brant, Oct 10, 2003
    #5
  6. Tim

    Tim Guest

    Roger Hunt wrote in message news:<gWjrZIAxoth$>...

    > > Wow! Does it take SIMMS? How many ISA slots? ;-)


    Roger, you're killing me already with your SIMMS and ISA slots and its
    nearly 2004! It would appear by your mail server, you're not in the
    US, anyway.

    I know someone who was using DOS6.22/Windows 3.1 until approx. 18
    months ago, including an old Windows 3.1 version of AOL. Even after
    building a newer computer and moving to 98SE, they found some
    third-party shareware utility to make Windows Explorer work like the
    old Norton File Manager. lol!

    Regards,

    Tim
    Tim, Oct 11, 2003
    #6
  7. Tim

    Roger Hunt Guest

    In article <>, Tim
    <> writes
    >Roger Hunt wrote in message news:<gWjrZIAxoth$>...
    >
    >> > Wow! Does it take SIMMS? How many ISA slots? ;-)

    >
    >Roger, you're killing me already with your SIMMS and ISA slots and its
    >nearly 2004! It would appear by your mail server, you're not in the
    >US, anyway.
    >

    This is post-Industrial England where everything costs six times as much
    as anywhere else - how can I afford to upgrade when I've only got two
    SIMMS to rub together?
    >I know someone who was using DOS6.22/Windows 3.1 until approx. 18
    >months ago, including an old Windows 3.1 version of AOL. Even after
    >building a newer computer and moving to 98SE, they found some
    >third-party shareware utility to make Windows Explorer work like the
    >old Norton File Manager. lol!
    >

    Yay! That's the spirit. I'm using 95b because it works so well, and if I
    could do it in w31 I would! :)

    Cheers!
    --
    Roger Hunt
    Roger Hunt, Oct 11, 2003
    #7
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