Leopard or Snow Leopard or Nothing?

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Glen Labah, May 26, 2010.

  1. Glen Labah

    Glen Labah Guest

    About a month ago I purchased used a PowerBook G4. While certainly not
    the latest thing on the market, it is enough for what I do. It was also
    a huge advancement (not necessarily an improvement in all ways) over
    what I had been using - which dated all the way back to OS 8.6 (really,
    I have no need of a huge amount of the stuff that comes built into most
    OSs these days).

    Those who remember when I used to post to this newsgroup several years
    ago will remember I was pretty much the last one whose newsreader gave
    some really arcane results thanks to it being Newswather (not MT
    newswater, but the 1980s era news reader that predated it).

    In any event I have been exploring the various features of the MacOS,
    and the ability to use wireless networking and the like is certainly a
    huge improvement over the old desktop.

    However, the MacOS version that came with this is OS 10.4. I went
    through the entire upgrade process to get it up to 10.4.11. However,
    10.4 didn't come with Pages, and the version of Preview that came with
    10.4 doesn't appear to have the ability to resize images. There are one
    or two other things that are missing that might be helpful too.

    The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    around for a little while, however:

    + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?

    + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    intended for Intel based Macs?

    + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.

    + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    dig it out of the drawer.

    + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    without the inermediate step?

    + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos &
    etc. to a large external firewire drive?

    Thanks for any thoughts.

    --
    Please note this e-mail address is a pit of spam due to e-mail address
    harvesters on Usenet. Response time to e-mail sent here is slow.
     
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  2. nospam

    nospam Guest

    In article <-september.org>,
    Glen Labah <> wrote:

    > + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?


    not an option for a powerbook g4. snow leopard will not run at all on
    powerpc macs. leopard is your only upgrade, or stay at 10.4.11.

    > + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    > intended for Intel based Macs?


    see above.

    > + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    > 10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    > 9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    > Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    > that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    > justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.
    >
    > + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    > everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    > laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    > dig it out of the drawer.


    there is no classic in leopard. if the software is not os x native, it
    cannot be used.

    > + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    > without the inermediate step?


    none, but you don't have that option with that computer.

    > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos &
    > etc. to a large external firewire drive?


    it's a bit of a pain to upgrade the hard drive. actually, putting it
    back together is the tricky part.

    put the photos and videos on a large external drive. it's easier and
    you can use it with any computer.
     
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  3. David Empson

    David Empson Guest

    Glen Labah <> wrote:

    > About a month ago I purchased used a PowerBook G4. While certainly not
    > the latest thing on the market, it is enough for what I do. It was also
    > a huge advancement (not necessarily an improvement in all ways) over
    > what I had been using - which dated all the way back to OS 8.6 (really,
    > I have no need of a huge amount of the stuff that comes built into most
    > OSs these days).
    >
    > Those who remember when I used to post to this newsgroup several years
    > ago will remember I was pretty much the last one whose newsreader gave
    > some really arcane results thanks to it being Newswather (not MT
    > newswater, but the 1980s era news reader that predated it).
    >
    > In any event I have been exploring the various features of the MacOS,
    > and the ability to use wireless networking and the like is certainly a
    > huge improvement over the old desktop.
    >
    > However, the MacOS version that came with this is OS 10.4. I went
    > through the entire upgrade process to get it up to 10.4.11. However,
    > 10.4 didn't come with Pages


    No version of Mac OS X comes with Pages.

    Pages is part of the iWork suite, sold separately from Mac OS X. The
    current version (iWork '09) runs on 10.4.11, but I expect the next
    version will require Leopard.

    Some Macs came with a _trial_ version of iWork preinstalled, but this
    was part of the bundled software for the computer, not part of Mac OS X.
    You had to buy iWork to use it beyond the 30 day trial period (which
    starts when you first ran any of the applications in the iWork suite).

    Similarly, the iLife suite (iPhoto, iMovie, etc.) is supplied (in full)
    with new Macs as part of the bundled software, but it is not included in
    the retail package for Mac OS X. If you want a later version than the
    one which came with your computer, you need to buy it as a retail
    product.

    Since the start of 2009, Apple has been selling a "Mac Box Set" product,
    which is equivalent to buying a particular edition of Mac OS X, iLife
    and iWork, for a discount which in the US effectively meant you got
    either iLife or iWork for free. (The pricing equation got more
    complicated after the release of Snow Leopard, due to its price being
    much lower than Leopard; other countries vary considerably due to
    exchange rate changes between the release dates of the various
    products.)

    The original Mac Box Set (January 2009) included Mac OS X 10.5.6, iLife
    '09 and iWork '09. It was updated in August 2009 to include Mac OS X
    10.6 instead of 10.5.

    > and the version of Preview that came with 10.4 doesn't appear to have the
    > ability to resize images. There are one or two other things that are
    > missing that might be helpful too.


    Apart from any other factors, Apple is no longer supporting 10.4 for any
    software updates (with the possible exception of Safari and iTunes, and
    I don't expect them to continue much longer).

    Leopard will still be supported until the release of 10.7, and due to
    Apple's current emphasis on the iPhone and iPad universe, I don't expect
    we'll see 10.7 before mid 2011.

    > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > around for a little while, however:
    >
    > + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?


    You can't on that computer. Snow Leopard requires an Intel processor.
    The PowerBook G4 has a PowerPC processor. Leopard is the last version of
    Mac OS X it can run.

    You should also confirm that your PowerBook G4 meets the system
    requirements for Leopard: at least 867 MHz processor, 512 MB of RAM (I'd
    strongly recommend having more RAM than that), and 9 GB of free disk
    space (more would be good).

    > + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    > intended for Intel based Macs?


    I know many people using Leopard on G4s. It can be a bit sluggish on
    low-end models, but is fine on faster models, as long as you give it
    plenty of memory.

    > + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    > 10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    > 9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    > Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    > that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    > justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.


    Fair enough.

    > + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    > everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    > laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    > dig it out of the drawer.


    Note that 10.5 can't run Classic, whereas 10.4 can.

    If your PowerBook G4 is old enough to be able to boot into Mac OS 9
    (roughly 2003 or earlier) then you could set it up with a separate
    partition containing a bootable Mac OS 9 system, and restart the
    computer to switch operating systems.

    A PowerBook G4 of that sort of age is likely to be too slow to be
    officially supported by Leopard, or slow enough that it would be
    tedious.

    For later models, a similar option would be to partition the hard drive
    with 10.5 as your main system and a second partition with 10.4 and Mac
    OS 9, which can be used with Classic.

    I have a PowerMac G4 (QuickSilver 2002) as my "last PowerPC Mac". I've
    deliberately left it running Tiger so I have easy access to old
    software, but at some point I'm intending to set up Leopard as its main
    operating system and put Tiger plus Mac OS 9 on a second hard drive. I
    still have a working PowerMac 8600 with Mac OS 9, so don't really need
    to use it on the G4.

    > + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    > without the inermediate step?


    Moot point because you can't run Snow Leopard, but if you had an Intel
    Mac running Tiger, my experience having done a few such upgrades is that
    I haven't observed any problems.

    > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that?


    No particular reason to do the hard drive upgrade at the same time, as
    long as you have enough space. Leopard needs a fair amount more disk
    space than Tiger. (Snow Leopard needs a fair amount less.)

    If you have a means to connect the old drive externally, you could do
    the hard drive swap, install Leopard on the new drive, and migrate data
    from the old one, keeping it running Tiger. Tidy up the new drive to
    remove anything you don't want in the Leopard system after the
    migration.

    Note that Disk Utility in Leopard can repartition a hard drive without
    erasing it (growing or shrinking the size of a partition, and add or
    remove later ones; you can't shift the start position of a partition).

    Depending on the PowerBook G4 model, replacing the hard drive is
    anything from relatively easy (Titanium 15" models) through medium
    difficulty (Aluminium 15" models) through a pain the neck (12").

    They all use parallel ATA hard drives, which are limited in capacity and
    manufacturers, so your upgrade options aren't as good as with more
    recent models.

    > Or move photos & etc. to a large external firewire drive?


    That would certainly be easier.
    --
    David Empson
     
  4. Glen Labah wrote:

    > + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?


    You can't.

    > + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    > intended for Intel based Macs?


    It only works on Intel based Macs. It won't even boot on a G4.

    > + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    > 10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    > 9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    > Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    > that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    > justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.
    >
    > + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    > everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    > laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    > dig it out of the drawer.


    You can run SheepShaver, a PPC emulator. It will run MacOS 7.6 up to
    9.0.4.


    > + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    > without the inermediate step?


    Not an issue in this case.

    > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos &
    > etc. to a large external firewire drive?


    Yes.

    Now that you found out you can't do what you ask, you have to decide if it is
    worth the upgrade to Leopard and ask a whole new set of questions.

    Geoff.



    --
    Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
    New word I coined 12/13/09, "Sub-Wikipedia" adj, describing knowledge or
    understanding, as in he has a sub-wikipedia understanding of the situation.
    i.e possessing less facts or information than can be found in the Wikipedia.
     
  5. Glen Labah wrote:
    > About a month ago I purchased used a PowerBook G4. While certainly not
    > the latest thing on the market, it is enough for what I do. It was also
    > a huge advancement (not necessarily an improvement in all ways) over
    > what I had been using - which dated all the way back to OS 8.6 (really,
    > I have no need of a huge amount of the stuff that comes built into most
    > OSs these days).
    >
    > Those who remember when I used to post to this newsgroup several years
    > ago will remember I was pretty much the last one whose newsreader gave
    > some really arcane results thanks to it being Newswather (not MT
    > newswater, but the 1980s era news reader that predated it).
    >
    > In any event I have been exploring the various features of the MacOS,
    > and the ability to use wireless networking and the like is certainly a
    > huge improvement over the old desktop.
    >
    > However, the MacOS version that came with this is OS 10.4. I went
    > through the entire upgrade process to get it up to 10.4.11. However,
    > 10.4 didn't come with Pages, and the version of Preview that came with
    > 10.4 doesn't appear to have the ability to resize images. There are one
    > or two other things that are missing that might be helpful too.
    >
    > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > around for a little while, however:
    >
    > + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?
    >
    > + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    > intended for Intel based Macs?
    >
    > + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    > 10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    > 9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    > Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    > that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    > justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.
    >
    > + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    > everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    > laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    > dig it out of the drawer.
    >
    > + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    > without the inermediate step?
    >
    > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos&
    > etc. to a large external firewire drive?
    >
    > Thanks for any thoughts.
    >

    IF its an Intel Mac you would be better of going straight to snow Leopard.

    I OTOH have PowerPC Computer I would love to get my hands on a copy of
    X.5 there are a couple of programs I wish to get that run on nothing
    prior to Leopard.

    --
    Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T. "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
    http://www.phillipmjones.net mailto:p
     
  6. Glen Labah wrote:
    > About a month ago I purchased used a PowerBook G4. While certainly not
    > the latest thing on the market, it is enough for what I do. It was also
    > a huge advancement (not necessarily an improvement in all ways) over
    > what I had been using - which dated all the way back to OS 8.6 (really,
    > I have no need of a huge amount of the stuff that comes built into most
    > OSs these days).
    >
    > Those who remember when I used to post to this newsgroup several years
    > ago will remember I was pretty much the last one whose newsreader gave
    > some really arcane results thanks to it being Newswather (not MT
    > newswater, but the 1980s era news reader that predated it).
    >
    > In any event I have been exploring the various features of the MacOS,
    > and the ability to use wireless networking and the like is certainly a
    > huge improvement over the old desktop.
    >
    > However, the MacOS version that came with this is OS 10.4. I went
    > through the entire upgrade process to get it up to 10.4.11. However,
    > 10.4 didn't come with Pages, and the version of Preview that came with
    > 10.4 doesn't appear to have the ability to resize images. There are one
    > or two other things that are missing that might be helpful too.
    >
    > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > around for a little while, however:
    >
    > + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?
    >
    > + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    > intended for Intel based Macs?
    >
    > + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    > 10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    > 9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    > Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    > that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    > justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.
    >
    > + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    > everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    > laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    > dig it out of the drawer.
    >
    > + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    > without the inermediate step?
    >
    > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos &
    > etc. to a large external firewire drive?
    >
    > Thanks for any thoughts.
    >



    1. Consider learning how to express yourself concisely.

    2. Don't post post multilevel complex questions and expect a clear answer.
     
  7. Wes Groleau

    Wes Groleau Guest

    Begging on Usenet doesn't work

    But I'm going to try anyway.

    PLEASE don't quote an entire two-page post only to add two lines proving
    you didn't read the first line.

    --
    Wes Groleau

    A pessimist says the glass is half empty.
    An optimist says the glass is half full.
    An engineer says somebody made the glass
    twice as big as it needed to be.
     
  8. David Sankey

    David Sankey Guest

    In article <htj3i5$nms$-september.org>,
    Phillip Jones <> wrote:

    > Glen Labah wrote:
    > > About a month ago I purchased used a PowerBook G4. While certainly not
    > > the latest thing on the market, it is enough for what I do. It was also
    > > a huge advancement (not necessarily an improvement in all ways) over
    > > what I had been using - which dated all the way back to OS 8.6 (really,
    > > I have no need of a huge amount of the stuff that comes built into most
    > > OSs these days).
    > >
    > > Those who remember when I used to post to this newsgroup several years
    > > ago will remember I was pretty much the last one whose newsreader gave
    > > some really arcane results thanks to it being Newswather (not MT
    > > newswater, but the 1980s era news reader that predated it).
    > >
    > > In any event I have been exploring the various features of the MacOS,
    > > and the ability to use wireless networking and the like is certainly a
    > > huge improvement over the old desktop.
    > >
    > > However, the MacOS version that came with this is OS 10.4. I went
    > > through the entire upgrade process to get it up to 10.4.11. However,
    > > 10.4 didn't come with Pages, and the version of Preview that came with
    > > 10.4 doesn't appear to have the ability to resize images. There are one
    > > or two other things that are missing that might be helpful too.
    > >
    > > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > > around for a little while, however:
    > >
    > > + With snow leopard available, should I just upgrade to that?
    > >
    > > + Does snow leopard even work that well on G4s? Isn't it really
    > > intended for Intel based Macs?
    > >
    > > + Legacy software was at one time an issue, and that is why I kept OS
    > > 10.4 on it for the past month, but I now have an old laptop that runs OS
    > > 9.2 just fine, and it can be used to run, for example, my old version of
    > > Photoshop, illustrator, and a few other several hundred dollar programs
    > > that I used to use from time to time, but don't use enough right now to
    > > justify buying completely new versions for use with OS 10.5 +.
    > >
    > > + It would, however, be kind of convenient to have the ability to run
    > > everything on one computer - but not really a vital function. The old
    > > laptop doesn't take up that much space, and if I really need to I can
    > > dig it out of the drawer.
    > >
    > > + Are there any severe issues going directly from 10.4 to Snow Leopard
    > > without the inermediate step?
    > >
    > > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos&
    > > etc. to a large external firewire drive?
    > >
    > > Thanks for any thoughts.
    > >

    > IF its an Intel Mac you would be better of going straight to snow Leopard.
    >
    > I OTOH have PowerPC Computer I would love to get my hands on a copy of
    > X.5 there are a couple of programs I wish to get that run on nothing
    > prior to Leopard.


    Snow Leopard does not run on PPC, so won't run on PowerBook G4.

    Tiger as you now have is the last version to support Classic, which is
    what you need to run your old old applications. Therefore if you
    upgrade to Leopard you will lose this possibility.

    No versions of Mac OS come with Pages, this is part of the iWork
    package. The current version of this still supports 10.4.11.

    Changing the internal disk in a Powerbook is not impossible, but also
    not trivial. And 80 GB is tight now.

    Kind regards,

    Dave
     
  9. Jolly Roger wrote:
    > In article <htj4co$rfh$>,
    > Joseph Capgras <> wrote:
    >
    >> 1. Consider learning how to express yourself concisely.
    >>
    >> 2. Don't post post multilevel complex questions and expect a clear answer.


    There are several clear answers.

    > I have a much better idea. Why don't YOU consider being nicer to people
    > and actually offering useful advice, instead? Why are you here?


    Indeed!
    And learn to trim.

    --
    john mcwilliams
     
  10. Glen Labah

    Glen Labah Guest

    In article <1jj45i2.12oywfs1o34senN%>,
    (David Empson) wrote:

    > You should also confirm that your PowerBook G4 meets the system
    > requirements for Leopard: at least 867 MHz processor, 512 MB of RAM (I'd
    > strongly recommend having more RAM than that), and 9 GB of free disk
    > space (more would be good).



    Right.

    It's a PowerBook Aluminum 15", 1.25 GHz, 1 GB.

    --
    Please note this e-mail address is a pit of spam due to e-mail address
    harvesters on Usenet. Response time to e-mail sent here is slow.
     
  11. In article <260520100845599160%>,
    sbt <> wrote:

    > In article <-september.org>,
    > Glen Labah <> wrote:

    [snip]
    > > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > > around for a little while, however:
    > >

    > I would be surprised if it was $200/package as the SRP for Leopard was
    > $129. Maybe it's a bundled package with iLife and iWork, as that was in
    > that price ballpark (although I think it was still under $200).


    It's probably either the Family Pack (SRP $199 US), or the Family Pack version
    of the Mac Box Set (Leopard + iLife + iWork, $229).
    The single-license version of the Mac Box Set was only $169.
     
  12. Glen Labah

    Glen Labah Guest

    In article <260520100845599160%>,
    sbt <> wrote:

    > In article <-september.org>,
    > Glen Labah <> wrote:
    >
    > > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > > around for a little while, however:
    > >

    > I would be surprised if it was $200/package as the SRP for Leopard was
    > $129. Maybe it's a bundled package with iLife and iWork, as that was in
    > that price ballpark (although I think it was still under $200).



    My thanks to all who offered their advice.

    I'd like to go the Leopard route, and the boxed set with iLife and
    iWork, as it would be helpful sometimes to have a word processor.

    However, it doesn't appear that any OS 10.5 boxed sets are available
    very easily any more. I'm seeing prices up in the $300 range just for
    OS 10.5. I've checked eBay, and there is a used box set for sale via
    that route, but it is in Europe.

    Couple of sellers have just the OS.

    I've also checked C/L too, but not much of interest anywhere near where
    I live.

    Any thoughts on retailers that might still have an older version of the
    OS still around?

    --
    Please note this e-mail address is a pit of spam due to e-mail address
    harvesters on Usenet. Response time to e-mail sent here is slow.
     
  13. Glen Labah

    Glen Labah Guest

    In article <>,
    Lewis <> wrote:

    > In message <-september.org>
    > Glen Labah <> wrote:
    > > In article <1jj45i2.12oywfs1o34senN%>,
    > > (David Empson) wrote:

    >
    > >> You should also confirm that your PowerBook G4 meets the system
    > >> requirements for Leopard: at least 867 MHz processor, 512 MB of RAM (I'd
    > >> strongly recommend having more RAM than that), and 9 GB of free disk
    > >> space (more would be good).

    >
    >
    > > Right.

    >
    > > It's a PowerBook Aluminum 15", 1.25 GHz, 1 GB.

    >
    > That will run 10.5 just fine, if you can scrape more RAM, it will run
    > better (I think that machine can do 2GB. Best bet is to max it out.)



    While I know that this is a matter of personal perception, does 10.5 run
    faster or slower than 10.4 on a PowerPC computer? I know that Apple has
    been working on cleaning up some of the older code in the OS. However,
    the minimum speed seems to imply there is enough overhead that a
    significant slowdown may be noticed in the transition.

    --
    Please note this e-mail address is a pit of spam due to e-mail address
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  14. Glen Labah

    Glen Labah Guest

    In article <260520100033114357%>,
    nospam <> wrote:

    > In article <-september.org>,
    > Glen Labah <> wrote:
    >
    > > + It would probably be a good idea for me to install a larger hard drive
    > > in the computer, and I assume that would be best done at the same time
    > > as the upgrade to Snow Leopard. Any thoughts on that? Or move photos &
    > > etc. to a large external firewire drive?

    >
    > it's a bit of a pain to upgrade the hard drive. actually, putting it
    > back together is the tricky part.
    >
    > put the photos and videos on a large external drive. it's easier and
    > you can use it with any computer.



    Something like this?
    http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=11356

    With the ability to run off of the USB bus, plus the ability to do
    Firewire, seems like it would work fairly well.

    (I'm somewhat entertained by the specifications that state it is not
    recommended to drop the drive while it is operating.)

    --
    Please note this e-mail address is a pit of spam due to e-mail address
    harvesters on Usenet. Response time to e-mail sent here is slow.
     
  15. nospam

    nospam Guest

    In article <-september.org>,
    Glen Labah <> wrote:

    > While I know that this is a matter of personal perception, does 10.5 run
    > faster or slower than 10.4 on a PowerPC computer?


    it's about the same. some things are a little faster, others are a
    little slower.
     
  16. In article <-september.org>,
    Glen Labah <> wrote:

    > In article <260520100845599160%>,
    > sbt <> wrote:
    >
    > > In article <-september.org>,
    > > Glen Labah <> wrote:
    > >
    > > > The local Mac store still has versions of Leopard available in the box
    > > > on the shelf at somewhat over $200 a package. I can probably find used
    > > > versions somewhere at a bit of a discount now that Snow Leopard has been
    > > > around for a little while, however:
    > > >

    > > I would be surprised if it was $200/package as the SRP for Leopard was
    > > $129. Maybe it's a bundled package with iLife and iWork, as that was in
    > > that price ballpark (although I think it was still under $200).

    >
    >
    > My thanks to all who offered their advice.
    >
    > I'd like to go the Leopard route, and the boxed set with iLife and
    > iWork, as it would be helpful sometimes to have a word processor.
    >

    Is that possible? I thought that Leopard only came out in two versions:
    the Single User or the Family Pack for five computers.

    The Boxed Set with iLife and iWork occurred with Snow Leopard but not
    Leopard IIRC.

    For a word processor, you could get a copy of NeoOffice. Contributions
    are requested but not required.

    <http://www.neooffice.org/neojava/en/index.php>

    Another word processor is Nisus Writer (probably Express based on your
    description).

    <http://nisus.com/>

    > However, it doesn't appear that any OS 10.5 boxed sets are available
    > very easily any more. I'm seeing prices up in the $300 range just for
    > OS 10.5. I've checked eBay, and there is a used box set for sale via
    > that route, but it is in Europe.
    >
    > Couple of sellers have just the OS.
    >
    > I've also checked C/L too, but not much of interest anywhere near where
    > I live.
    >
    > Any thoughts on retailers that might still have an older version of the
    > OS still around?



    Try here. I found it on Yahoo by searching for Leopard Apple Operating
    System:

    <http://www1.bottomdollar.com/search_attrib.php/page_id=180/form_keyword=
    apple+leopard+operating+system/rd=1/skd=1/st=query>
    --
    Remove blown from email address to reply.
     
  17. In article
    <
    ple.com>, "Thomas R. Kettler" <> wrote:

    > The Boxed Set with iLife and iWork occurred with Snow Leopard but not
    > Leopard IIRC.


    It came with Leopard too, but not initially.

    --
    Check out the Hot Cocoa Party
    <http://www.hotcocoaparty.info>
     
  18. David Empson

    David Empson Guest

    Thomas R. Kettler <> wrote:

    > In article <-september.org>,
    > Glen Labah <> wrote:
    >
    > > My thanks to all who offered their advice.
    > >
    > > I'd like to go the Leopard route, and the boxed set with iLife and
    > > iWork, as it would be helpful sometimes to have a word processor.
    > >

    > Is that possible? I thought that Leopard only came out in two versions:
    > the Single User or the Family Pack for five computers.
    >
    > The Boxed Set with iLife and iWork occurred with Snow Leopard but not
    > Leopard IIRC.


    Mac Box Set was introduced in January 2009, with Mac OS X 10.5.6
    (Leopard), iLife '09 and iWork '09. (I bought it to get the new iLife
    and iWork, and sold off my previous copy of Mac OS X 10.5 as I didn't
    need two of them).

    It was updated in August 2009, with Snow Leopard instead of Leopard.

    Both the Leopard and Snow Leopard versions of the Mac Box Set came in
    single licence and family pack editions.

    (As I've already said earlier in this thread.)

    --
    David Empson
     
  19. David Empson

    David Empson Guest

    Jolly Roger <> wrote:

    > In article <-september.org>,
    > Glen Labah <> wrote:
    >
    > > My thanks to all who offered their advice.
    > >
    > > I'd like to go the Leopard route, and the boxed set with iLife and
    > > iWork, as it would be helpful sometimes to have a word processor.
    > >
    > > However, it doesn't appear that any OS 10.5 boxed sets are available
    > > very easily any more. I'm seeing prices up in the $300 range just for
    > > OS 10.5. I've checked eBay, and there is a used box set for sale via
    > > that route, but it is in Europe.
    > >
    > > Couple of sellers have just the OS.
    > >
    > > I've also checked C/L too, but not much of interest anywhere near where
    > > I live.
    > >
    > > Any thoughts on retailers that might still have an older version of the
    > > OS still around?

    >
    > You aren't looking in the right places.
    >
    > Go to http://google.com, then click the "Shopping" link at the very top
    > of the page.
    >
    > Then enter one of these:
    >
    > "mac os x" 10.5
    > ilife
    > iwork
    >
    > I see Mac OS X 10.5 for $30 at a whole lot of places.


    I don't know where you see that. I tried a search on google.com (after
    bypassing its automatic redirection to the New Zealand page, which
    doesn't have the shopping feature). My search was for

    "mac os x" 10.5 Leopard -Snow

    and the cheapest listing was US$111 for a new family pack (there was
    mention of a $70 used one but no actual entry for it). Other family
    packs were listed at $260 new and $300 new. Original retail price was
    US$199.

    Single licence edition prices ranged from $189 (used) to $253
    (refurbished). Original retail price was US$129.

    eBay is probably the best solution.

    I've been trying to buy a copy of Mac OS X 10.5 on behalf of someone on
    our local equivalent (TradeMe) for a few months, and I know two other
    people who want them. One comes up every few weeks, but I haven't
    managed to get one yet. I missed a couple that were reasonably cheap,
    others have sold or been passed in at more than 75% of original retail,
    in one case about 95% before adding postage.

    There are a few family packs there at the moment, but the opening bid or
    buy now is about 75% of original retail, and way too expensive for a
    single user.

    Demand for upgrading PowerPC Macs to Leopard is high, and supplies are
    limited.

    --
    David Empson
     
  20. Glen Labah

    Glen Labah Guest

    In article
    <
    xample.com>,
    "Thomas R. Kettler" <> wrote:


    > Try here. I found it on Yahoo by searching for Leopard Apple Operating
    > System:
    >
    > <http://www1.bottomdollar.com/search_attrib.php/page_id=180/form_keyword=
    > apple+leopard+operating+system/rd=1/skd=1/st=query>



    Still pretty much the cheapest available there is $200. Thanks for the
    effort though.

    --
    Please note this e-mail address is a pit of spam due to e-mail address
    harvesters on Usenet. Response time to e-mail sent here is slow.
     
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