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Need help picking a new MB

Discussion in 'Overclocking' started by Tony, Feb 4, 2008.

  1. Tony

    Tony Guest

    I've been an Abit user for many years with no difficulties. But my last
    board (still in use) was/is the AI7, and I kept track of the problems
    reported on Abit after the time of this board (wondering if the company had
    hit a turning point for the worse). I'm looking to move up but I'm wondering
    if I should stick with these guys. My needs and desires at this point...

    - P35
    - Stable in OC. I'm willing to get to 90% of the theoretical best OC state
    if the board can do so and run like clockwork.
    - Reliable
    - Able to migrate slowly to new components. I'll be starting with my current
    ATI AGP board and DDR2 mem, so it has to work well with older gear for a
    bit, including IDE drives.
    - Able to run 24/7. My IT5 had run and current AI7 runs 24/7 and the AI7 has
    done so for years without a lick of trouble.
    - Well laid out with PS conx toward the top where they should be.
    - Able to do SATA raid with proven reliability.
    - Must support IEEE1348
    - Excellent on board Ethernet performance

    I'm currently looking at the Abit IP35 Pro, the Asus P5K-E LGA, and the Giga
    GA-P35-DS3 (but I'm not sure I really understand the diff between the P, R,
    and L). I know they are all rated pretty well by Newegg buyers, and I know
    there are plenty of fans for each here in this group, but I need to find out
    if one would be the preferred choice to suit my N&D list.
     
    Tony, Feb 4, 2008
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Tony

    Augustus Guest

    "Tony" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I've been an Abit user for many years with no difficulties. But my last
    > board (still in use) was/is the AI7, and I kept track of the problems
    > reported on Abit after the time of this board (wondering if the company
    > had hit a turning point for the worse). I'm looking to move up but I'm
    > wondering if I should stick with these guys. My needs and desires at this
    > point...
    >
    > - P35
    > - Stable in OC. I'm willing to get to 90% of the theoretical best OC state
    > if the board can do so and run like clockwork.
    > - Reliable
    > - Able to migrate slowly to new components. I'll be starting with my
    > current ATI AGP board and DDR2 mem, so it has to work well with older gear
    > for a bit, including IDE drives.


    There are no Intel P35 boards out there with an AGP slot, and I can assure
    you there never will be. So you won't be migrating slowly to a new video
    card. Ditto for your IDE hard drives. The ABit, Asus and the Gigabyte all
    have one single ATA133 or ATA100 port. So decide if you want your burners on
    that port or maybe it's time to say goodbye to your IDE HDD's at the same
    time.
     
    Augustus, Feb 4, 2008
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Tony

    Fishface Guest

    Tony wrote:
    ..
    > - Must support IEEE1348


    Ok, I give up...
     
    Fishface, Feb 4, 2008
    #3
  4. Tony

    RobV Guest

    Fishface wrote:
    > Tony wrote:
    > .
    >> - Must support IEEE1348

    >
    > Ok, I give up...


    ROTFLOL !!!
     
    RobV, Feb 4, 2008
    #4
  5. Tony

    Augustus Guest

    "Fishface" <?> wrote in message
    news:1Vvpj.2292$eD3.1530@trndny05...
    > Tony wrote:
    > .
    >> - Must support IEEE1348

    >
    > Ok, I give up...


    I'm beginning to think this is a deliberate troll.....
     
    Augustus, Feb 4, 2008
    #5
  6. Tony

    Tony Guest

    Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    No, this is not a troll post, but I did write in haste last night and made
    some errors. So forgive me and let me make some corrections. I know I
    sounded like an idiot, but let's just chalk it up to exhaustion and a bit of
    dyslexia. If I was as dumb as the original post sounded I wouldn't have been
    too successful building my own systems for the last 20 years. :)

    I meant IEEE1394, of course, not 1348.
    Delete the AGP request. Was looking at too many boards over the past few
    days.
    I don't see IDE as being a problem. My burners are all in external drives. I
    will either keep them there or swap them with the hard drives so they'd be
    internal.

    After you're all done throwing dead fish at me I would still appreciate the
    help.

    "Tony" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I've been an Abit user for many years with no difficulties. But my last
    > board (still in use) was/is the AI7, and I kept track of the problems
    > reported on Abit after the time of this board (wondering if the company
    > had hit a turning point for the worse). I'm looking to move up but I'm
    > wondering if I should stick with these guys. My needs and desires at this
    > point...
    >
    > - P35
    > - Stable in OC. I'm willing to get to 90% of the theoretical best OC state
    > if the board can do so and run like clockwork.
    > - Reliable
    > - Able to migrate slowly to new components. I'll be starting with my
    > current ATI AGP board and DDR2 mem, so it has to work well with older gear
    > for a bit, including IDE drives.
    > - Able to run 24/7. My IT5 had run and current AI7 runs 24/7 and the AI7
    > has done so for years without a lick of trouble.
    > - Well laid out with PS conx toward the top where they should be.
    > - Able to do SATA raid with proven reliability.
    > - Must support IEEE1348
    > - Excellent on board Ethernet performance
    >
    > I'm currently looking at the Abit IP35 Pro, the Asus P5K-E LGA, and the
    > Giga GA-P35-DS3 (but I'm not sure I really understand the diff between the
    > P, R, and L). I know they are all rated pretty well by Newegg buyers, and
    > I know there are plenty of fans for each here in this group, but I need to
    > find out if one would be the preferred choice to suit my N&D list.
    >
     
    Tony, Feb 5, 2008
    #6
  7. Tony

    Augustus Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    "Tony" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > No, this is not a troll post, but I did write in haste last night and made
    > some errors. So forgive me and let me make some corrections. I know I
    > sounded like an idiot, but let's just chalk it up to exhaustion and a bit
    > of dyslexia. If I was as dumb as the original post sounded I wouldn't have
    > been too successful building my own systems for the last 20 years. :)
    >
    > I meant IEEE1394, of course, not 1348.
    > Delete the AGP request. Was looking at too many boards over the past few
    > days.
    > I don't see IDE as being a problem. My burners are all in external drives.
    > I will either keep them there or swap them with the hard drives so they'd
    > be internal.
    >
    > After you're all done throwing dead fish at me I would still appreciate
    > the help.


    Ok...I'll take you at your word. Try this one on for size....
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130097

    Has firewire, DDR2 support, ATA100 IDE support, 6 SATA, nicely optioned out.
     
    Augustus, Feb 5, 2008
    #7
  8. Tony

    Phil Weldon Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    'Tony' wrote:
    | No, this is not a troll post, but I did write in haste last night and made
    | some errors. So forgive me and let me make some corrections. I know I
    | sounded like an idiot, but let's just chalk it up to exhaustion and a bit
    of
    | dyslexia. If I was as dumb as the original post sounded I wouldn't have
    been
    | too successful building my own systems for the last 20 years. :)
    |
    | I meant IEEE1394, of course, not 1348.
    | Delete the AGP request. Was looking at too many boards over the past few
    | days.
    | I don't see IDE as being a problem. My burners are all in external drives.
    I
    | will either keep them there or swap them with the hard drives so they'd be
    | internal.
    |
    | After you're all done throwing dead fish at me I would still appreciate
    the
    | help.
    _____

    Well, just to add to your troubles, with in the next 12 months the 'Nehalem'
    CPU line comes out; new socket new motherboards, new chipset, new memory
    required. So perhaps you should keep in mind that you may really, really
    want a new new system less than a year after THIS new system. I'd suggest a
    relatively inexpensive motherboard and CPU, and be satisfied by a good
    overclock. That way you will be more willing to go for the next latest and
    greatest.

    Back to your original post:
    "Stable in OC. I'm willing to get 90% of the theoretical best OC state
    if the board can do so and run like clockwork."
    There IS no 'theoretical best OC'. Each CPU produced can have different
    overclocking potential. There is a probability curve for the overclock that
    can be expected, but no guarantees.

    "Able to migrate slowly to new components."
    Well, WHAT new components? There isn't much to be gained with new
    CD/DVD drives, but that really isn't a problem because almost ANY new
    motherboard can support two IDE ATA drives. DDR2 RAM will work in any
    motherboard. ISA sockets have already gone away, and PCI slots are going
    away. If you end up using two video cards, it is unlikely ANY motherboard
    will have more than one PCI slot available. There just aren't that many
    components other than memory, CPU, and video card to plug into a motherboard
    any more.

    Since you wish to overclock, I'd suggest you look through posts to this
    newsgroup in the last year and choose a motherboard based on those posts.

    Phil Weldon



    Phil Weldon

    "Tony" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    | No, this is not a troll post, but I did write in haste last night and made
    | some errors. So forgive me and let me make some corrections. I know I
    | sounded like an idiot, but let's just chalk it up to exhaustion and a bit
    of
    | dyslexia. If I was as dumb as the original post sounded I wouldn't have
    been
    | too successful building my own systems for the last 20 years. :)
    |
    | I meant IEEE1394, of course, not 1348.
    | Delete the AGP request. Was looking at too many boards over the past few
    | days.
    | I don't see IDE as being a problem. My burners are all in external drives.
    I
    | will either keep them there or swap them with the hard drives so they'd be
    | internal.
    |
    | After you're all done throwing dead fish at me I would still appreciate
    the
    | help.
    |
    | "Tony" <> wrote in message
    | news:...
    | > I've been an Abit user for many years with no difficulties. But my last
    | > board (still in use) was/is the AI7, and I kept track of the problems
    | > reported on Abit after the time of this board (wondering if the company
    | > had hit a turning point for the worse). I'm looking to move up but I'm
    | > wondering if I should stick with these guys. My needs and desires at
    this
    | > point...
    | >
    | > - P35
    | > - Stable in OC. I'm willing to get to 90% of the theoretical best OC
    state
    | > if the board can do so and run like clockwork.
    | > - Reliable
    | > - Able to migrate slowly to new components. I'll be starting with my
    | > current ATI AGP board and DDR2 mem, so it has to work well with older
    gear
    | > for a bit, including IDE drives.
    | > - Able to run 24/7. My IT5 had run and current AI7 runs 24/7 and the AI7
    | > has done so for years without a lick of trouble.
    | > - Well laid out with PS conx toward the top where they should be.
    | > - Able to do SATA raid with proven reliability.
    | > - Must support IEEE1348
    | > - Excellent on board Ethernet performance
    | >
    | > I'm currently looking at the Abit IP35 Pro, the Asus P5K-E LGA, and the
    | > Giga GA-P35-DS3 (but I'm not sure I really understand the diff between
    the
    | > P, R, and L). I know they are all rated pretty well by Newegg buyers,
    and
    | > I know there are plenty of fans for each here in this group, but I need
    to
    | > find out if one would be the preferred choice to suit my N&D list.
    | >
    |
    |
     
    Phil Weldon, Feb 5, 2008
    #8
  9. Tony

    RobV Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    Augustus wrote:
    > "Tony" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    >> No, this is not a troll post, but I did write in haste last night
    >> and made some errors. So forgive me and let me make some
    >> corrections. I know I sounded like an idiot, but let's just chalk it
    >> up to exhaustion and a bit of dyslexia. If I was as dumb as the
    >> original post sounded I wouldn't have been too successful building
    >> my own systems for the last 20 years. :) I meant IEEE1394, of
    >> course, not 1348.
    >> Delete the AGP request. Was looking at too many boards over the past
    >> few days.
    >> I don't see IDE as being a problem. My burners are all in external
    >> drives. I will either keep them there or swap them with the hard
    >> drives so they'd be internal.
    >>
    >> After you're all done throwing dead fish at me I would still
    >> appreciate the help.

    >
    > Ok...I'll take you at your word. Try this one on for size....
    > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130097
    >
    > Has firewire, DDR2 support, ATA100 IDE support, 6 SATA, nicely
    > optioned out.


    Nice pick! I would get it myself if I were building a system.
     
    RobV, Feb 5, 2008
    #9
  10. Tony

    Tony Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    "Augustus" <> wrote in message
    news:8_Opj.10097$C61.8435@edtnps89...
    >
    > "Tony" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    >> No, this is not a troll post, but I did write in haste last night and
    >> made some errors. So forgive me and let me make some corrections. I know
    >> I sounded like an idiot, but let's just chalk it up to exhaustion and a
    >> bit of dyslexia. If I was as dumb as the original post sounded I wouldn't
    >> have been too successful building my own systems for the last 20 years.
    >> :)
    >>
    >> I meant IEEE1394, of course, not 1348.
    >> Delete the AGP request. Was looking at too many boards over the past few
    >> days.
    >> I don't see IDE as being a problem. My burners are all in external
    >> drives. I will either keep them there or swap them with the hard drives
    >> so they'd be internal.
    >>
    >> After you're all done throwing dead fish at me I would still appreciate
    >> the help.

    >
    > Ok...I'll take you at your word. Try this one on for size....
    > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130097
    >
    > Has firewire, DDR2 support, ATA100 IDE support, 6 SATA, nicely optioned
    > out.
    >


    Hmm, it does look nice, and with the rebate it's at a decent price. I've
    heard good things about MSI as being a respectable MB builder without
    necessarily the kind of spotlight Asus and Abit sometimes get. I am a little
    concerned about the reviews which touch on the possible BIOS issues and
    "slowness". What's the broader consensus on how it may stack up in that
    regard?

    Is there anything (apart from price) that would lead me away from the IP35
    Pro or P5K-E?
     
    Tony, Feb 5, 2008
    #10
  11. Tony

    Tony Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    "Phil Weldon" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Well, just to add to your troubles, with in the next 12 months the
    > 'Nehalem'
    > CPU line comes out; new socket new motherboards, new chipset, new memory
    > required. So perhaps you should keep in mind that you may really, really
    > want a new new system less than a year after THIS new system. I'd suggest
    > a
    > relatively inexpensive motherboard and CPU, and be satisfied by a good
    > overclock. That way you will be more willing to go for the next latest
    > and
    > greatest.
    >


    I tend to stay just behind the bleeding edge when it comes to putting
    systems together. I'm not a heavy gamer, but I do a bit of work in digital
    photography and MATLAB simulations. I've found that staying with something
    that's had a chance to be wrung out has worked well for me. My AI7 is going
    on 4-1/2 years. I expect my next choice to go at least this long.

    > Back to your original post:
    > "Stable in OC. I'm willing to get 90% of the theoretical best OC state
    > if the board can do so and run like clockwork."
    > There IS no 'theoretical best OC'. Each CPU produced can have
    > different
    > overclocking potential. There is a probability curve for the overclock
    > that
    > can be expected, but no guarantees.
    >


    Understood. I guess the point I wanted to make was that I would rather move
    toward a board that had a decent OC record without enetring into the area of
    being able to push a chip a little bit more than another board - at the
    expense of higher risk. I recognize a lot of success in OC'ing is based on a
    given CPU, but some boards have absolutely poor records in being able to OC
    while others are at the top end of the scale for serious OC junkies. I'm
    looking to be juuust a bit behind that front line.

    > "Able to migrate slowly to new components."
    > Well, WHAT new components? There isn't much to be gained with new
    > CD/DVD drives, but that really isn't a problem because almost ANY new
    > motherboard can support two IDE ATA drives. DDR2 RAM will work in any
    > motherboard. ISA sockets have already gone away, and PCI slots are going
    > away. If you end up using two video cards, it is unlikely ANY
    > motherboard
    > will have more than one PCI slot available. There just aren't that many
    > components other than memory, CPU, and video card to plug into a
    > motherboard
    > any more.
    >


    Looking to get a new system up quickly, meaning I will use my older DDR2 and
    IDE/PATA drives, and will migrate to "newer" (for me) components as
    necessary.

    > Since you wish to overclock, I'd suggest you look through posts to this
    > newsgroup in the last year and choose a motherboard based on those posts.


    That's how I got to the ones I did. If you can recommend something that you
    think would be comparable to the IP35 Pro, P5K-E, or P35-DS3 - or for my
    purposes better - at less cost I would be happy to know about it.

    -Tony
     
    Tony, Feb 5, 2008
    #11
  12. Tony

    Augustus Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    > Is there anything (apart from price) that would lead me away from the IP35
    > Pro or P5K-E?

    Just the fact that Newegg is currently out of stock on that particular
    item....however, they usually get stock fairly quickly and there are other
    vendors.
     
    Augustus, Feb 5, 2008
    #12
  13. Tony

    Phil Weldon Guest

    Re: Let me take my foot out of my backside...

    'Tony' wrote:
    | That's how I got to the ones I did. If you can recommend something that
    you
    | think would be comparable to the IP35 Pro, P5K-E, or P35-DS3 - or for my
    | purposes better - at less cost I would be happy to know about it.
    _____

    Well, my current overclocking motherboard is an EVGA 680i. I am well
    satisfied with the performance, BUT.

    1. nVidia's nTune has a 'hands-off' overclocking function; it is worse
    than useless. Not only does it hang after making no progress, but the
    so-called 'system load' that it uses is hardly more than 10 or 15 percent
    load (a 3D window that covers only about 1/6 the screen. ) On the other
    hand, I don't think ANY 'hands-off' overclocking function from ANY
    motherboard manufacturer is any more useful.

    2. nVida's chipsets allow for changing more overclocking parameters
    than any other chipset (seven voltage, three frequency reference, one CPU
    Clock : Memory Clock ratio, twelve memory timing, and a partridge in a pear
    tree.) On the other hand, the manual is none too clear, and no further
    information can be weaseled out of nVidia or EVGA. At the moment I have an
    E4300 installed running at 2.7 GHz with a core voltage below specification
    and DDR2-1066 memory running at DDR2-1200. The maximum overclock is limited
    by CPU temperature as I need a high CPU core voltage to get above ~ 3.1 GHz,
    and the bother of better cooling isn't worth the trouble with an E4300.

    3. Nice motherboard cooling system (nVidia reference board); a
    Southbridge heatsink connected by a heatpipe to the Northbridge heatsink
    that has fins and a fan.

    4. Two gigabit LAN ports

    5. Two PCI-e X16 slots, one PCI-e X 8 slot, two PCI-e X 1 slots, one
    PCI-e X 8 slot (physical X 16), two PCI slots, one IDE ATA connector, one
    floppy connector, six SATA/SATA3 connectors (w/RAID , six USB 2.0
    connectors, 1 IEEE1394a connector, and an SPDIF.

    6. The 680i is expensive ($197 US) as is the newer EVGA 780i
    motherboard ($250 US). The EVGA 680i LT ($170 US) drops the PCI-e X 8 slot
    and one of the two Gigabit LAN ports. The MSI P6N SLI-FI 650i nVidia
    chipset motherboard is $85 US at newegg.com has a similar connector set to
    the EVGA 680i LT, but adds a second IDE ATA connector. {I've never owned an
    MSI motherboard; just aBit, Intel, and now EVGA.}

    The choice I face in continuing to overclock is
    EITHER
    replace the E4300 with a Q6400 and stick with that for a few
    years
    OR
    keep the E4300 until 'Nehalem' and replace the CPU, memory, and
    motherboard
    AND ON THE THIRD HAND
    fool around with water cooling (already have the components) and
    put off making a decision as long as possible B^)



    Phil Weldon


    "Tony" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    |
    | "Phil Weldon" <> wrote in message
    | news:...
    | > Well, just to add to your troubles, with in the next 12 months the
    | > 'Nehalem'
    | > CPU line comes out; new socket new motherboards, new chipset, new memory
    | > required. So perhaps you should keep in mind that you may really,
    really
    | > want a new new system less than a year after THIS new system. I'd
    suggest
    | > a
    | > relatively inexpensive motherboard and CPU, and be satisfied by a good
    | > overclock. That way you will be more willing to go for the next latest
    | > and
    | > greatest.
    | >
    |
    | I tend to stay just behind the bleeding edge when it comes to putting
    | systems together. I'm not a heavy gamer, but I do a bit of work in digital
    | photography and MATLAB simulations. I've found that staying with something
    | that's had a chance to be wrung out has worked well for me. My AI7 is
    going
    | on 4-1/2 years. I expect my next choice to go at least this long.
    |
    | > Back to your original post:
    | > "Stable in OC. I'm willing to get 90% of the theoretical best OC
    state
    | > if the board can do so and run like clockwork."
    | > There IS no 'theoretical best OC'. Each CPU produced can have
    | > different
    | > overclocking potential. There is a probability curve for the overclock
    | > that
    | > can be expected, but no guarantees.
    | >
    |
    | Understood. I guess the point I wanted to make was that I would rather
    move
    | toward a board that had a decent OC record without enetring into the area
    of
    | being able to push a chip a little bit more than another board - at the
    | expense of higher risk. I recognize a lot of success in OC'ing is based on
    a
    | given CPU, but some boards have absolutely poor records in being able to
    OC
    | while others are at the top end of the scale for serious OC junkies. I'm
    | looking to be juuust a bit behind that front line.
    |
    | > "Able to migrate slowly to new components."
    | > Well, WHAT new components? There isn't much to be gained with new
    | > CD/DVD drives, but that really isn't a problem because almost ANY new
    | > motherboard can support two IDE ATA drives. DDR2 RAM will work in any
    | > motherboard. ISA sockets have already gone away, and PCI slots are
    going
    | > away. If you end up using two video cards, it is unlikely ANY
    | > motherboard
    | > will have more than one PCI slot available. There just aren't that many
    | > components other than memory, CPU, and video card to plug into a
    | > motherboard
    | > any more.
    | >
    |
    | Looking to get a new system up quickly, meaning I will use my older DDR2
    and
    | IDE/PATA drives, and will migrate to "newer" (for me) components as
    | necessary.
    |
    | > Since you wish to overclock, I'd suggest you look through posts to this
    | > newsgroup in the last year and choose a motherboard based on those
    posts.
    |
    | That's how I got to the ones I did. If you can recommend something that
    you
    | think would be comparable to the IP35 Pro, P5K-E, or P35-DS3 - or for my
    | purposes better - at less cost I would be happy to know about it.
    |
    | -Tony
    |
    |
     
    Phil Weldon, Feb 5, 2008
    #13
  14. Howard Goldstein, Feb 6, 2008
    #14
  15. Howard Goldstein, Feb 6, 2008
    #15
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