1. This forum section is a read-only archive which contains old newsgroup posts. If you wish to post a query, please do so in one of our main forum sections (here). This way you will get a faster, better response from the members on Motherboard Point.

Problems with X850 and possible best AGP cards

Discussion in 'ATI' started by Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL], Apr 3, 2009.

  1. After a recent LAN party my son's PC has been running like a dog. The
    current ATI X850 PE only puts out about 9 fps in TF2. It was running
    fine before so not sure what happened.
    One "funny" issue is that even after I reinstall it after full driver
    cleanup, the "ATI Radeon" tab doesn't show up in the Advanced tab under
    Display properties. (When you do a right-click Properties, Settings Tab,
    Advanced button)
    It's like the video card is not really installed. I show in the hardware
    list but just generally runs like crap in games now.

    Since his system is an older AMD 939 4200+ on a A8V board which still
    has AGP port, I was also wondering what the latest AGP card available
    is. From what I can Google I think it's a X1650 Pro? Or maybe even an
    HD3650 or HD3850?

    J

    --
    Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Jethro
    Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com
    Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL], Apr 3, 2009
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. * Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]:
    > Since his system is an older AMD 939 4200+ on a A8V board which still
    > has AGP port, I was also wondering what the latest AGP card available
    > is. From what I can Google I think it's a X1650 Pro? Or maybe even an
    > HD3650 or HD3850?


    HD3850. However, you should be aware that AGP support has a very low
    priority for ATI/AMD which means that the AGP versions usually cause
    much more troubles than the PCIe versions. I would think twice about
    investing any money in such an old AGP system.

    Benjamin
    Benjamin Gawert, Apr 5, 2009
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. First of One wrote:
    > "Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]" <> wrote in message
    > news:gr5bhd$ee8$...
    >> After a recent LAN party my son's PC has been running like a dog. The
    >> current ATI X850 PE only puts out about 9 fps in TF2. It was running fine
    >> before so not sure what happened.

    >
    > Did you disable any ATI startup programs or services previously, like
    > ATISmart? If so, re-enable them, for they are somehow tied to basic 3D
    > acceleration. You are using XP?


    Using XP. Actually it is a fresh install as we also had HDD issues and
    started from scratch.

    > There should be a SmartGART tab in the control panel. Make sure AGP is
    > enabled there.


    In the display properties? There is no extra tabs in the Display
    properties. When I did a test install of a Nvidia 6600GT it should up in
    the display properties.

    >
    >> One "funny" issue is that even after I reinstall it after full driver
    >> cleanup, the "ATI Radeon" tab doesn't show up in the Advanced tab under
    >> Display properties. (When you do a right-click Properties, Settings Tab,
    >> Advanced button) It's like the video card is not really installed. I show
    >> in the hardware list but just generally runs like crap in games now.

    >
    > Could be any number of reasons...
    > - Power cable dislodged from card in transit

    removed reinstalled card
    > - Disabled startup programs or services

    such as?? just did fresh windows install

    > - Incorrect BIOS AGP setting

    hmmm.. I had upgraded BIOS to last version 0229... did I miss something
    I wonder now? Any specific settings?

    > - Incorrect driver
    > - Virus/worm/trojan

    clean windows install

    > What drivers are you using?


    I think the non-CCC I used was 8.2

    >
    >> Since his system is an older AMD 939 4200+ on a A8V board which still has
    >> AGP port, I was also wondering what the latest AGP card available is. From
    >> what I can Google I think it's a X1650 Pro? Or maybe even an HD3650 or
    >> HD3850?

    >
    > HD3850. The Sapphire card Bill linked is pretty good.


    Now not being an ATI fanboi, what is nVidia's best AGP (I think 7600
    GS?)and how would that compare?


    --
    Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Jethro
    Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com
    Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL], Apr 6, 2009
    #3
  4. Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]

    Tom Guest

    Benjamin Gawert <> wrote in
    news: thusly:

    > * Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]:
    >> Since his system is an older AMD 939 4200+ on a A8V board which still
    >> has AGP port, I was also wondering what the latest AGP card available
    >> is. From what I can Google I think it's a X1650 Pro? Or maybe even an
    >> HD3650 or HD3850?

    >
    > HD3850. However, you should be aware that AGP support has a very low
    > priority for ATI/AMD which means that the AGP versions usually cause
    > much more troubles than the PCIe versions. I would think twice about
    > investing any money in such an old AGP system.


    Really? And, what are those troubles you speak of?

    --

    Tom
    Tom, Apr 8, 2009
    #4
  5. First of One wrote:
    > "Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]" <> wrote in message
    > news:grd7m5$uto$...
    >> Using XP. Actually it is a fresh install as we also had HDD issues and
    >> started from scratch.

    >
    > Since the board is an A8V, did you install the VIA AGP drivers? If not,
    > download and install them:
    > http://www.viaarena.com/Driver/VIA_HyperionPro_V523A.zip You only need the
    > AGP driver (aka miniport driver or GART driver).
    >
    >> In the display properties? There is no extra tabs in the Display
    >> properties. When I did a test install of a Nvidia 6600GT it should up in
    >> the display properties.
    >>
    >> I think the non-CCC I used was 8.2

    >
    > You installed the 8.2 standalone driver without CCC? Then there wouldn't be
    > extra tabs in Display Properties, as ATI stopped bundling the old Control
    > Panel with drivers long before 8.2.
    >
    >>> HD3850. The Sapphire card Bill linked is pretty good.

    >> Now not being an ATI fanboi, what is nVidia's best AGP (I think 7600
    >> GS?)and how would that compare?

    >
    > Best nVidia AGP card is the XFX 7950GT AGP. Driver support is flaky because
    > only XFX makes them. It is on par with ATI X1900-series cards. The HD3850 is
    > *two generations* newer with commensurate difference in performance.
    >


    Well I did another drivers update. Installed Cat9.2 with full CCC and
    Dot Net v2. Finally got a proper tab in the Display Properties -
    Advanced settings.
    "Seemed" to work well afterwards. I played TF2 and seemed to be getting
    40-60 fps. Thought it was all good.
    My son went to another TF2 map with more open spaces and Pyros and he
    says the performance dropped off and got all laggy. Going to check and
    try to get some hard numbers from the net_graph as opposed to a "feeling".

    Thanks for all your suggestions.

    J
    --
    Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Jethro
    Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com
    Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL], Apr 9, 2009
    #5
  6. First of One wrote:
    > "Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]" <> wrote in message
    > news:grd7m5$uto$...
    >> Using XP. Actually it is a fresh install as we also had HDD issues and
    >> started from scratch.

    >
    > Since the board is an A8V, did you install the VIA AGP drivers? If not,
    > download and install them:
    > http://www.viaarena.com/Driver/VIA_HyperionPro_V523A.zip You only need the
    > AGP driver (aka miniport driver or GART driver).
    >
    >> In the display properties? There is no extra tabs in the Display
    >> properties. When I did a test install of a Nvidia 6600GT it should up in
    >> the display properties.
    >>
    >> I think the non-CCC I used was 8.2

    >
    > You installed the 8.2 standalone driver without CCC? Then there wouldn't be
    > extra tabs in Display Properties, as ATI stopped bundling the old Control
    > Panel with drivers long before 8.2.
    >
    >>> HD3850. The Sapphire card Bill linked is pretty good.

    >> Now not being an ATI fanboi, what is nVidia's best AGP (I think 7600
    >> GS?)and how would that compare?

    >
    > Best nVidia AGP card is the XFX 7950GT AGP. Driver support is flaky because
    > only XFX makes them. It is on par with ATI X1900-series cards. The HD3850 is
    > *two generations* newer with commensurate difference in performance.
    >


    Well I did another drivers update. Installed Cat9.2 with full CCC and
    Dot Net v2. Finally got a proper tab in the Display Properties -
    Advanced settings.
    "Seemed" to work well afterwards. I played TF2 and seemed to be getting
    40-60 fps. Thought it was all good.
    My son went to another TF2 map with more open spaces and Pyros and he
    says the performance dropped off and got all laggy. Going to check and
    try to get some hard numbers from the net_graph as opposed to a "feeling".

    Thanks for all your suggestions.

    J
    --
    Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Jethro
    Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com
    Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL], Apr 9, 2009
    #6
  7. * Tom:
    >> However, you should be aware that AGP support has a very low
    >> priority for ATI/AMD which means that the AGP versions usually cause
    >> much more troubles than the PCIe versions. I would think twice about
    >> investing any money in such an old AGP system.

    >
    > Really? And, what are those troubles you speak of?


    For example instability, very low performance and display errors.

    Benjamin
    Benjamin Gawert, Apr 10, 2009
    #7
  8. Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]

    Tom Guest

    Benjamin Gawert <> wrote in
    news: thusly:

    >>> However, you should be aware that AGP support has a very low
    >>> priority for ATI/AMD which means that the AGP versions usually cause
    >>> much more troubles than the PCIe versions. I would think twice about
    >>> investing any money in such an old AGP system.

    >>
    >> Really? And, what are those troubles you speak of?

    >
    > For example instability, very low performance and display errors.


    I can certainly understand that there is an AGP bottleneck, but I've
    seen no signs of instability or display errors with my Sapphire HD3850
    and a Asus P4C800-E Deluxe Motherboard. These "troubles" must depend on
    some other factor. Thanks for the info.

    --

    Tom
    Tom, Apr 10, 2009
    #8
  9. * Tom:

    >>> Really? And, what are those troubles you speak of?

    >> For example instability, very low performance and display errors.

    >
    > I can certainly understand that there is an AGP bottleneck,


    There is no "AGP bottleneck" which causes the problems.

    > but I've
    > seen no signs of instability or display errors with my Sapphire HD3850
    > and a Asus P4C800-E Deluxe Motherboard. These "troubles" must depend on
    > some other factor.


    Yes, as I said before they depend on the drivers of which the AGP part
    gets rarely updated at all. Simply because AMD doesn't give much on AGP
    support any more. In lots of cases the only driver that works stable is
    the one that comes with the card and which has been modified by the
    board maker, and as soon as the user updates the driver with the generic
    AMD Catalyst driver hell breaks loose.

    That you don't have any problems is fine for you, however it doesn't
    change the fact that the chance of experiencing problems is much higher
    with the AGP versions of Radeon HD 2000/3000 series cards than with
    their PCIe counterparts.

    Benjamin
    Benjamin Gawert, Apr 11, 2009
    #9
  10. Phat_Jethro aka Jethro[AGHL]

    Tom Guest

    In news: you wrote:

    >> I've seen no signs of instability or display errors with my Sapphire
    >> HD3850 and a Asus P4C800-E Deluxe Motherboard. These "troubles" must
    >> depend on some other factor.

    >
    > Yes, as I said before they depend on the drivers of which the AGP part
    > gets rarely updated at all. Simply because AMD doesn't give much on
    > AGP support any more. In lots of cases the only driver that works
    > stable is the one that comes with the card and which has been modified
    > by the board maker, and as soon as the user updates the driver with
    > the generic AMD Catalyst driver hell breaks loose.


    I can only offer what I personally have experienced. I did a lot of
    reading of reviews before finally purchasing the AGP Sapphire HD3850.

    One of the most apparent criticisms of all AGP HD3850 cards regardless
    of manufacture was that the supplied drivers on CD were horrible. Nearly
    all recommended bypassing the included CD for the ATI Catalyst drivers.

    I didn't use the drivers on the CD and instead installed the Catalyst
    9.1 drivers directly from ATI/AMD and it worked right out of the box
    with my old Intel 875P chipset software that's dated March 25, 2004.

    In the case of Sapphire, they don't modify their drivers. The driver
    available at the Sapphire site is the same driver that is available at
    the ATI/AMD site. That might be a reason to go with the AGP Sapphire
    HD3850 over other manufactures.

    > That you don't have any problems is fine for you, however it doesn't
    > change the fact that the chance of experiencing problems is much
    > higher with the AGP versions of Radeon HD 2000/3000 series cards than
    > with their PCIe counterparts.


    Well, the chance of experiencing problems is much higher if you have a
    VIA motherboard. :)

    I can't speak for all situations, but it seems to me that the likelihood
    of having problems depends on more factors than only the driver.

    --

    Tom
    Tom, Apr 15, 2009
    #10
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Paul
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    789
    Big Sky
    Jan 20, 2006
  2. Replies:
    1
    Views:
    469
    Tom Scales
    Sep 15, 2005
  3. pigdos
    Replies:
    17
    Views:
    518
    First of One
    Jan 15, 2006
  4. Ernie
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    377
    Steph
    Jan 18, 2006
  5. Kent_Diego
    Replies:
    6
    Views:
    443
    First of One
    May 10, 2007
Loading...

Share This Page