Re: Mac OS X 10.8 (Mountain Lion) Released

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Howard S Shubs, Jul 26, 2012.

  1. In article <>,
    Jolly Roger <> wrote:

    > Yey! Mac OS X 10.8 (Mountain Lion) was released today! It's available on
    > the App Store right now at $19.99, and is chock full of improvements and
    > new feature goodness!
    >
    > <http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/os-x-10-8/24/>


    Please name some features which people w/o any iOS devices might be
    interested in.

    --
    May joy be yours all the days of your life! - Phina
    We are but a moment's sunlight, fading in the grass. - The Youngbloods
    Those who eat natural foods die of natural causes. - Kperspective
    Howard S Shubs, Jul 26, 2012
    #1
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  2. Howard S Shubs

    Davoud Guest

    Someone wrote:
    > > <http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/os-x-10-8/24/>


    Howard S Shubs:
    > Please name some features which people w/o any iOS devices might be
    > interested in.


    I haven't bought Mountain Lion yet, so I can't answer your question.
    (Don't despair, though; another person who also hasn't seen Mountain
    Lion and who knows nothing about it will give you a detailed answer!)

    I just wanted to comment on the referenced article. What a load of
    dingo's kidneys! I read the first paragraph and choked. In a world that
    is increasingly inured to bad journalism--if that sort of writing even
    deserves to be called journalism--this piece has earned a spot in the
    egregiousness hall of fame.

    "In Lion, OS X began shedding the well-worn trappings of traditional
    desktop computing at an accelerated rate."

    Really? Speaking of well-worn, could he have possibly written a cornier
    sentence? And how is it, then, that I am still using this shedding OS
    the way I have for years, still running Creative Suite and Aperture and
    Final Cut and MS Office and all of my astronomy apps just as I did in
    the pre-lion days? Like so many people, the author has mistaken
    interface changes--which are a well established practice in new
    versions of the Mac OS, and many of which are optional--for a switch
    from OS X to iOS. Hello!? It's still the Mac OS. Does it evolve?
    Surprise--it does!

    "This trend continues in Mountain Lion. Where Lion stumbled, Mountain
    Lion regroups and tries again‹while still forging bravely ahead in
    other areas."

    What in the hell is this guy doing with his Mac? On our five Macs that
    can run Lion, including two aging MB Pros, Lion is the most stable OS
    to date. The rest of that is just gobbledygook. Operating systems can't
    forge ahead, bravely /or/ reluctantly. People do that.

    Reading on, I learned that "Mountain Lion is not the Mac OS of the
    past..." Wow, really? And then I learned that Mac nerds "are not the
    center of the market." No s**t!? Did he mean to say that some people
    actually do gainful work with their Macs rather than sitting around
    running benchmarks and, above all, hoping that it breaks so that they
    can either a) fix it or b) complain that they can't get the case open
    to fix it.

    I hope you're still with me, because the payoff comes toward the end of
    page one: The Mac is "the computer for the rest of us." I love that!
    Why didn't I coin that clever phrase? Or Apple?

    OK, that's all I have. The article goes on for an astounding 23 pages.
    In the middle of the second page the author switches his writing style
    to Vogon iambic pentameter. I predict a spike in the suicide rate among
    ars technica readers.

    --
    I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
    you will say in your entire life.

    usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
    Davoud, Jul 26, 2012
    #2
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  3. Howard S Shubs

    Lewis Guest

    In message <250720122236452342%>
    Davoud <> wrote:
    > Someone wrote:
    >> > <http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/os-x-10-8/24/>


    > Howard S Shubs:
    >> Please name some features which people w/o any iOS devices might be
    >> interested in.


    > I haven't bought Mountain Lion yet, so I can't answer your question.
    > (Don't despair, though; another person who also hasn't seen Mountain
    > Lion and who knows nothing about it will give you a detailed answer!)


    > I just wanted to comment on the referenced article. What a load of
    > dingo's kidneys! I read the first paragraph and choked. In a world that
    > is increasingly inured to bad journalism--if that sort of writing even
    > deserves to be called journalism--this piece has earned a spot in the
    > egregiousness hall of fame.


    Keep in mind you are reading the first paragraph on *PAGE 24*

    --
    'Things either exist or they don't,' said Jeremy. 'I am very clear about
    that. I have medicine.' --The Thief of Time
    Lewis, Jul 26, 2012
    #3
  4. Howard S Shubs

    JF Mezei Guest

    Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they appear,
    are semi transparent ?

    Why does Apple insist on that transparency thing which reduces readability ?
    JF Mezei, Jul 26, 2012
    #4
  5. Howard S Shubs

    Davoud Guest

    JF Mezei:

    > Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they appear,
    > are semi transparent ?
    >
    > Why does Apple insist on that transparency thing which reduces readability ?


    Cher ami,

    You wrote that in response to /my/ post, the one in which I said that I
    have not seen Mountain Lion and don't know anything about it!?

    OK, I probably should have said that I don't know anything about ML's
    new features. I'm taking a stab in the dark and guessing that File Edit
    View Window Help remain where they have long been.

    A thing cannot be semi-transparent. Translucency has degrees that
    depend on the amount of light that a substance transmits, but
    opaqueness and transparency are absolutes (for everyday purposes).

    --
    I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
    you will say in your entire life.

    usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
    Davoud, Jul 26, 2012
    #5
  6. In article <260720120907440073%>, Davoud <>
    wrote:

    > JF Mezei:
    >
    > > Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they appear,
    > > are semi transparent ?


    The Ars Technica article has an image of the scroll bars in Lion and
    Mountain Lion. Both are translucent, but Lion blurs what's behind them
    while Mountain Lion leaves it alone. So it's more readable in ML than L.

    > >
    > > Why does Apple insist on that transparency thing which reduces readability ?


    Wouldn't making the scroll bars opaque reduce readbility even more? If
    you don't like the temporary scroll bars, use the system preference to
    make them permanent, and then I don't think they'll overlap the text.

    >
    > Cher ami,
    >
    > You wrote that in response to /my/ post, the one in which I said that I
    > have not seen Mountain Lion and don't know anything about it!?


    I don't think he was asking you specifically, this is a group
    discussion, not a one-on-one conversation.

    --
    Barry Margolin,
    Arlington, MA
    *** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***
    Barry Margolin, Jul 26, 2012
    #6
  7. Howard S Shubs

    Davoud Guest

    Davoud:
    > > Cher ami,


    > > You wrote that in response to /my/ post, the one in which I said that I
    > > have not seen Mountain Lion and don't know anything about it!?


    Barry Margolin:
    > I don't think he was asking you specifically, this is a group
    > discussion, not a one-on-one conversation.


    I understand that. I'm not terribly fond of smileys, and I'm not
    skilled in using them. If I have to tell you something is meant to be
    humorous, such as my response to JF Mezei, then I failed in my attempt
    to make it humorous. That appears to be the case here. I have learned
    to live with the my failings and frailties and get on with my life.
    Adding a smiley wouldn't have fixed my weak attempt at humor, would it?

    --
    I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
    you will say in your entire life.

    usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
    Davoud, Jul 26, 2012
    #7
  8. Howard S Shubs

    Alan Browne Guest

    On 2012-07-26 10:27 , Davoud wrote:
    > Davoud:
    >>> Cher ami,

    >
    >>> You wrote that in response to /my/ post, the one in which I said that I
    >>> have not seen Mountain Lion and don't know anything about it!?

    >
    > Barry Margolin:
    >> I don't think he was asking you specifically, this is a group
    >> discussion, not a one-on-one conversation.

    >
    > I understand that. I'm not terribly fond of smileys, and I'm not
    > skilled in using them. If I have to tell you something is meant to be
    > humorous, such as my response to JF Mezei, then I failed in my attempt
    > to make it humorous. That appears to be the case here. I have learned
    > to live with the my failings and frailties and get on with my life.
    > Adding a smiley wouldn't have fixed my weak attempt at humor, would it?


    It helps fend of anger when you're at risk of dropping a f/lame joke.


    --
    "Civilization is the limitless multiplication of unnecessary necessities."
    -Samuel Clemens.
    Alan Browne, Jul 26, 2012
    #8
  9. Howard S Shubs

    Alan Browne Guest

    On 2012-07-25 21:06 , Howard S Shubs wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Jolly Roger <> wrote:
    >
    >> Yey! Mac OS X 10.8 (Mountain Lion) was released today! It's available on
    >> the App Store right now at $19.99, and is chock full of improvements and
    >> new feature goodness!
    >>
    >> <http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/os-x-10-8/24/>

    >
    > Please name some features which people w/o any iOS devices might be
    > interested in.


    That nugget? That is so Mezei ca. 2010 or earlier.


    --
    "Civilization is the limitless multiplication of unnecessary necessities."
    -Samuel Clemens.
    Alan Browne, Jul 26, 2012
    #9
  10. Howard S Shubs

    Alan Browne Guest

    On 2012-07-25 22:36 , Davoud wrote:
    > Someone wrote:
    >>> <http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/os-x-10-8/24/>

    >
    > Howard S Shubs:
    >> Please name some features which people w/o any iOS devices might be
    >> interested in.

    >
    > I haven't bought Mountain Lion yet, so I can't answer your question.
    > (Don't despair, though; another person who also hasn't seen Mountain
    > Lion and who knows nothing about it will give you a detailed answer!)
    >
    > I just wanted to comment on the referenced article. What a load of
    > dingo's kidneys! I read the first paragraph and choked. In a world that
    > is increasingly inured to bad journalism--if that sort of writing even
    > deserves to be called journalism--this piece has earned a spot in the
    > egregiousness hall of fame.


    I was more amused at the trite garbage than angered but it recalls
    another poorly written article I saw recently. Paid by the word perhaps.


    --
    "Civilization is the limitless multiplication of unnecessary necessities."
    -Samuel Clemens.
    Alan Browne, Jul 26, 2012
    #10
  11. Howard S Shubs

    Kurt Ullman Guest

    In article <260720121027050984%>, Davoud <>
    wrote:

    > Adding a smiley wouldn't have fixed my weak attempt at humor, would it?


    It would of told us it was a weak attempt at humor. (g)
    --
    America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
    to work within the system, but too early to shoot
    the bastards."-- Claire Wolfe
    Kurt Ullman, Jul 26, 2012
    #11
  12. In article <>,
    Paul Sture <> wrote:

    > On Thu, 26 Jul 2012 10:07:48 -0400, Barry Margolin wrote:
    >
    > > In article <260720120907440073%>, Davoud <>
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > >> JF Mezei:
    > >>
    > >> > Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they
    > >> > appear,
    > >> > are semi transparent ?

    > >
    > > The Ars Technica article has an image of the scroll bars in Lion and
    > > Mountain Lion. Both are translucent, but Lion blurs what's behind them
    > > while Mountain Lion leaves it alone. So it's more readable in ML than
    > > L.

    >
    > I personally hate this fad for blurring stuff. My eyesight isn't what it
    > used to be so my natural inclination is to try and read it anyway.
    >
    > Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.


    Then I guess you're happy that they got rid of it in Mountain Lion.

    --
    Barry Margolin,
    Arlington, MA
    *** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***
    Barry Margolin, Jul 27, 2012
    #12
  13. Howard S Shubs

    John Young Guest

    In article <>,
    Paul Sture <> wrote:

    > On Thu, 26 Jul 2012 10:07:48 -0400, Barry Margolin wrote:
    >
    > > In article <260720120907440073%>, Davoud <>
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > >> JF Mezei:
    > >>
    > >> > Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they
    > >> > appear,
    > >> > are semi transparent ?

    > >
    > > The Ars Technica article has an image of the scroll bars in Lion and
    > > Mountain Lion. Both are translucent, but Lion blurs what's behind them
    > > while Mountain Lion leaves it alone. So it's more readable in ML than
    > > L.

    >
    > I personally hate this fad for blurring stuff. My eyesight isn't what it
    > used to be so my natural inclination is to try and read it anyway.
    >
    > Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.
    >
    > This fad has found its way into Windows and probably other GUIs as well.
    > I switch it off ASAP when I come across it.


    I have been using ML for a few months now and my scroll bars are just a
    light gray. Looks to me the same as Lion. A lot of people complained
    about the scroll bars in lion but it was a not a factor for me they just
    work fine after the changing the preference to show always and the
    direction of scroll.
    John Young, Jul 27, 2012
    #13
  14. Howard S Shubs

    Lewis Guest

    In message <-september.org>
    John Young <> wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Paul Sture <> wrote:


    >> On Thu, 26 Jul 2012 10:07:48 -0400, Barry Margolin wrote:
    >>
    >> > In article <260720120907440073%>, Davoud <>
    >> > wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> JF Mezei:
    >> >>
    >> >> > Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they
    >> >> > appear,
    >> >> > are semi transparent ?
    >> >
    >> > The Ars Technica article has an image of the scroll bars in Lion and
    >> > Mountain Lion. Both are translucent, but Lion blurs what's behind them
    >> > while Mountain Lion leaves it alone. So it's more readable in ML than
    >> > L.

    >>
    >> I personally hate this fad for blurring stuff. My eyesight isn't what it
    >> used to be so my natural inclination is to try and read it anyway.
    >>
    >> Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.
    >>
    >> This fad has found its way into Windows and probably other GUIs as well.
    >> I switch it off ASAP when I come across it.


    > I have been using ML for a few months now and my scroll bars are just a
    > light gray. Looks to me the same as Lion. A lot of people complained
    > about the scroll bars in lion but it was a not a factor for me they just
    > work fine after the changing the preference to show always and the
    > direction of scroll.


    Look again.

    The bars in Mnt Lion are quite different than in Lion. First off, when
    they first appear, they are much more translucent than in Lion. Text
    under them is readable. Second, when you move the mouse into the scroll
    area they get substantially wider (twice as wide? maybe more?). Third,
    they stay active as long as your pointer is in the scroll area.

    --
    Hard work pays off in the future. Laziness pays off now.
    Lewis, Jul 27, 2012
    #14
  15. Howard S Shubs

    JF Mezei Guest

    Barry Margolin wrote:

    >> Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.

    >
    > Then I guess you're happy that they got rid of it in Mountain Lion.



    But did they get rid of the stupid useless transparency ? Why do they
    put semi transpararent scroll bars ? Why ? What purpose does this serve
    except to diminist contrast and readability ?

    With Jobs gone, shouldn't Apple remove those fads that Jobs wanted
    merely for looks even when they detracted from usability ?
    JF Mezei, Jul 27, 2012
    #15
  16. Howard S Shubs

    John Young Guest

    In article <>,
    Lewis <> wrote:

    > In message <-september.org>
    > John Young <> wrote:
    > > In article <>,
    > > Paul Sture <> wrote:

    >
    > >> On Thu, 26 Jul 2012 10:07:48 -0400, Barry Margolin wrote:
    > >>
    > >> > In article <260720120907440073%>, Davoud <>
    > >> > wrote:
    > >> >
    > >> >> JF Mezei:
    > >> >>
    > >> >> > Is it really true that scroll bars on Mountain Lion, when they
    > >> >> > appear,
    > >> >> > are semi transparent ?
    > >> >
    > >> > The Ars Technica article has an image of the scroll bars in Lion and
    > >> > Mountain Lion. Both are translucent, but Lion blurs what's behind them
    > >> > while Mountain Lion leaves it alone. So it's more readable in ML than
    > >> > L.
    > >>
    > >> I personally hate this fad for blurring stuff. My eyesight isn't what it
    > >> used to be so my natural inclination is to try and read it anyway.
    > >>
    > >> Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.
    > >>
    > >> This fad has found its way into Windows and probably other GUIs as well.
    > >> I switch it off ASAP when I come across it.

    >
    > > I have been using ML for a few months now and my scroll bars are just a
    > > light gray. Looks to me the same as Lion. A lot of people complained
    > > about the scroll bars in lion but it was a not a factor for me they just
    > > work fine after the changing the preference to show always and the
    > > direction of scroll.

    >
    > Look again.
    >
    > The bars in Mnt Lion are quite different than in Lion. First off, when
    > they first appear, they are much more translucent than in Lion. Text
    > under them is readable. Second, when you move the mouse into the scroll
    > area they get substantially wider (twice as wide? maybe more?). Third,
    > they stay active as long as your pointer is in the scroll area.


    Not on my Mac. The scroll bars are always showing and just turn from
    light gray to dark gray when the curser is held over them. No text shows
    through. No difference in width. They are always active. I think the
    differences may be in some of the settings I in no way doubt what you
    are saying I think we have preferences set up diffetently. I paid the
    100 bucks so I have been using ML for some time now. Really only cost 80
    since I did not have to pay the 20 to upgrade from Lion.
    John Young, Jul 27, 2012
    #16
  17. In article <5012d567$0$1424$c3e8da3$>,
    JF Mezei <> wrote:

    > Barry Margolin wrote:
    >
    > >> Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.

    > >
    > > Then I guess you're happy that they got rid of it in Mountain Lion.

    >
    >
    > But did they get rid of the stupid useless transparency ? Why do they
    > put semi transpararent scroll bars ? Why ? What purpose does this serve
    > except to diminist contrast and readability ?


    Because they didn't like the alternatives. When the scroll bar pops up,
    they'd either have to shrink the rest of the window to make room or
    totally block whatever is under it.

    And they didn't want to go back to the old system of a dedicated scroll
    bar area in each window. They came up with the new style when designing
    for the small screens of phones and tablets, where they couldn't afford
    to waste any screen space. And they then decided that it's a good idea
    everywhere.

    --
    Barry Margolin,
    Arlington, MA
    *** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***
    Barry Margolin, Jul 27, 2012
    #17
  18. Howard S Shubs

    John Young Guest

    In article <5012d567$0$1424$c3e8da3$>,
    JF Mezei <> wrote:

    > Barry Margolin wrote:
    >
    > >> Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.

    > >
    > > Then I guess you're happy that they got rid of it in Mountain Lion.

    >
    >
    > But did they get rid of the stupid useless transparency ? Why do they
    > put semi transpararent scroll bars ? Why ? What purpose does this serve
    > except to diminist contrast and readability ?
    >
    > With Jobs gone, shouldn't Apple remove those fads that Jobs wanted
    > merely for looks even when they detracted from usability ?


    Again on my Mac they are NOT transparent. I have the option set to "Show
    Scroll Bars Always" . YMMV as some are reporting different behavior.
    John Young, Jul 27, 2012
    #18
  19. In article <-september.org>,
    John Young <> wrote:

    > In article <5012d567$0$1424$c3e8da3$>,
    > JF Mezei <> wrote:
    >
    > > Barry Margolin wrote:
    > >
    > > >> Consequently it annoys the hell out of me.
    > > >
    > > > Then I guess you're happy that they got rid of it in Mountain Lion.

    > >
    > >
    > > But did they get rid of the stupid useless transparency ? Why do they
    > > put semi transpararent scroll bars ? Why ? What purpose does this serve
    > > except to diminist contrast and readability ?
    > >
    > > With Jobs gone, shouldn't Apple remove those fads that Jobs wanted
    > > merely for looks even when they detracted from usability ?

    >
    > Again on my Mac they are NOT transparent. I have the option set to "Show
    > Scroll Bars Always" . YMMV as some are reporting different behavior.


    OK, so you have the option set to go back to the old behavior. We're
    talking about the NEW behavior that was introduced in Lion, and how it
    has changed from L to ML. Of course if you customize it, your
    experience is not relevant.

    --
    Barry Margolin,
    Arlington, MA
    *** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***
    Barry Margolin, Jul 27, 2012
    #19
  20. Howard S Shubs

    JF Mezei Guest

    Barry Margolin wrote:

    > Because they didn't like the alternatives. When the scroll bar pops up,
    > they'd either have to shrink the rest of the window to make room or
    > totally block whatever is under it.


    No need to resize the window. Just block what is under the scroll bar to
    increase readability. When you have semi transparent stuff, the stuff
    under it simply distracts , reduceces readability of stuff above it and
    serves no purpose since in semi transparent mode, it is barely readable.

    This transparency thing is just some programmer having impressed someone
    with programming skills and this being deployed as a "WOW" factor
    without any regards for whether this improves the readability on screen
    or not.
    JF Mezei, Jul 27, 2012
    #20
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