1. This forum section is a read-only archive which contains old newsgroup posts. If you wish to post a query, please do so in one of our main forum sections (here). This way you will get a faster, better response from the members on Motherboard Point.

Re: Matrox & Asus Being Jerks! P4C800-E Dlx + P650/P750 Fails During Boot!

Discussion in 'Matrox' started by Rapu Rapala, Apr 5, 2004.

  1. Rapu Rapala

    Rapu Rapala Guest

    Ummm. let's bring some facts to the discission, Ron claims to have written
    BIOS'es but fails to materialize the easy-to-understand explanation anyone
    who had, would be able to provide.

    You see, Ron, things that you know about are trivialized.. you don't need to
    act high and mighty to be able to explain what is the essense of things.

    Let's talk about IBM PC compatible BIOS.

    The interface to this BIOS is mostly interrupt 0x21, which is used to call
    code which resides in the read-only ROM memory in the so-called BIOS. This
    code is executed on x86 compatible processor by the x86 compatible
    processor, which is not a very hard thing to grasp.. what the BIOS contains,
    is x86 compatible binary code, obviously.

    This code is instructions to the motherboard and other components the BIOS
    supports (such as IDE, SATA, etc. controllers, whatever the MB supports that
    is within the scope of the IBM PC compatible BIOS...), this allows the
    common feature set to be commanded through standard interface.

    This was more relevant years ago, novadays Operating Systems such as
    Windows, Linux and others do most of the tasks with device drivers
    'natively'-- so the BIOS could be a lot simpler novadays, just pass the
    control to the OS bootstrap and let it do the rest. This is much more
    efficient, because BIOS is implemented using Real Mode and modern x86 OS
    runs in Protected Mode.

    Calls to the BIOS have to be done using API such as DPMI, which is not very
    efficient. It is far more efficient to do the I/O directly from the
    Protected Mode. Ofcourse different OS take different approach, Windows just
    allows drivers to write into memory where they want with full privileges
    which sometimes causes some instability with poorly written drivers. ;-) ;-)

    I'm assuming the reader knows what Protection Level and Ring 0 means so I
    won't insult anyone with excess babbling about how the privilege levels
    work.

    Interesting that adults find it more productive to argue who's right and
    who's wrong without any mentioning how the BIOS on IBM PC compatibles is
    supposed to be working.

    Disclaimer: I might have made error or two, tough shit, because haven't done
    any "BIOS" level programming for 10 years or so, Windows, BeOS, Linux, BSD
    and others kind of made it a Solved Problem. IBM PC compatible BIOS is not
    very interesting technically, never were, IMHO.

    It was the MS-DOS programmers who had to deal with the BIOS most. Those
    times are long past. Maybe someone somewhere is writing this embedded system
    controller/application/widget, who knows.. good for you whoever you may be!
    :)
    Rapu Rapala, Apr 5, 2004
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Rapu Rapala

    Ron Reaugh Guest

    "Rapu Rapala" <> wrote in message
    news:c4qfmv$4o2$...
    > Ummm. let's bring some facts to the discission, Ron claims to have written
    > BIOS'es but fails to materialize the easy-to-understand explanation anyone
    > who had, would be able to provide.
    >
    > You see, Ron, things that you know about are trivialized.. you don't need

    to
    > act high and mighty to be able to explain what is the essense of things.
    >
    > Let's talk about IBM PC compatible BIOS.
    >
    > The interface to this BIOS is mostly interrupt 0x21, which is used to call
    > code which resides in the read-only ROM memory in the so-called BIOS. This
    > code is executed on x86 compatible processor by the x86 compatible
    > processor, which is not a very hard thing to grasp.. what the BIOS

    contains,
    > is x86 compatible binary code, obviously.
    >
    > This code is instructions to the motherboard and other components the BIOS
    > supports (such as IDE, SATA, etc. controllers, whatever the MB supports

    that
    > is within the scope of the IBM PC compatible BIOS...), this allows the
    > common feature set to be commanded through standard interface.
    >
    > This was more relevant years ago, novadays Operating Systems such as
    > Windows, Linux and others do most of the tasks with device drivers
    > 'natively'-- so the BIOS could be a lot simpler novadays, just pass the
    > control to the OS bootstrap and let it do the rest. This is much more
    > efficient, because BIOS is implemented using Real Mode and modern x86 OS
    > runs in Protected Mode.
    >
    > Calls to the BIOS have to be done using API such as DPMI, which is not

    very
    > efficient. It is far more efficient to do the I/O directly from the
    > Protected Mode. Ofcourse different OS take different approach, Windows

    just
    > allows drivers to write into memory where they want with full privileges
    > which sometimes causes some instability with poorly written drivers. ;-)

    ;-)
    >
    > I'm assuming the reader knows what Protection Level and Ring 0 means so I
    > won't insult anyone with excess babbling about how the privilege levels
    > work.
    >
    > Interesting that adults find it more productive to argue who's right and
    > who's wrong without any mentioning how the BIOS on IBM PC compatibles is
    > supposed to be working.
    >
    > Disclaimer: I might have made error or two, tough shit, because haven't

    done
    > any "BIOS" level programming for 10 years or so, Windows, BeOS, Linux, BSD
    > and others kind of made it a Solved Problem. IBM PC compatible BIOS is not
    > very interesting technically, never were, IMHO.
    >
    > It was the MS-DOS programmers who had to deal with the BIOS most. Those
    > times are long past. Maybe someone somewhere is writing this embedded

    system
    > controller/application/widget, who knows.. good for you whoever you may

    be!

    HUH, again. This thread is about what happens during boot. This thread is
    about BIOSs and about what a display card's BIOS does especially during
    boot. Read the whole thread and get a clue.
    Ron Reaugh, Apr 5, 2004
    #2
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Rapu Rapala
    Replies:
    10
    Views:
    475
    Rapu Rapala
    Apr 5, 2004
  2. Rapu Rapala
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    276
    Ron Reaugh
    Apr 5, 2004
  3. Ron Reaugh
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    280
    Ron Reaugh
    Apr 5, 2004
  4. Rapu Rapala
    Replies:
    10
    Views:
    1,090
    Rapu Rapala
    Apr 5, 2004
  5. Ron Reaugh
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    793
    Ron Reaugh
    Apr 5, 2004
Loading...

Share This Page