Re: Suggestions for SATAII Hard drives

Discussion in 'Abit' started by Wes Newell, May 9, 2008.

  1. Wes Newell

    Wes Newell Guest

    On Fri, 09 May 2008 17:01:29 +0100, Seeker wrote:

    > I have a Abit AN8 Ultra motherboard with a nforce4 Ultra chipset. With
    > the latest BIOS and drivers
    > I have read these have a lot of problems with Sata Hard drives. I had a
    > Samsung HD753LJ 750GB Hard Drive SATAII but fdisk and format could only
    > find 196GB space on the disk.
    > The BIOS showed the disk and disk size correctly. So any suggestions for
    > SATAII Hard drives In the 500 to 750 GB range, that might work with this
    > motherboard.


    Hmmm... Seems to me that if the bios saw it correctly but the fdisk
    program didn't, the problem would be with the version of fdisk you are
    using.

    --
    Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
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    Wes Newell, May 9, 2008
    #1
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  2. Wes Newell

    Eeyore Guest

    Beryl wrote:

    > Seeker wrote:
    > > "Wes Newell" <> wrote in message
    > > news:c30Vj.175$T1.15@trnddc01...
    > >> On Fri, 09 May 2008 17:01:29 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    > >>
    > >>> I have a Abit AN8 Ultra motherboard with a nforce4 Ultra chipset. With
    > >>> the latest BIOS and drivers
    > >>> I have read these have a lot of problems with Sata Hard drives. I had a
    > >>> Samsung HD753LJ 750GB Hard Drive SATAII but fdisk and format could only
    > >>> find 196GB space on the disk.
    > >>> The BIOS showed the disk and disk size correctly. So any suggestions for
    > >>> SATAII Hard drives In the 500 to 750 GB range, that might work with this
    > >>> motherboard.
    > >> Hmmm... Seems to me that if the bios saw it correctly but the fdisk
    > >> program didn't, the problem would be with the version of fdisk you are
    > >> using.
    > >>
    > >> --
    > >> Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    > >> My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    > >> Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    > >> AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php

    > >
    > > I was using the wnME bootdisks fdisk and format.
    > > I thought that was the latest.

    >
    > WindowsME? That's not going to work.


    It IS what MS offer to boot XP systems from a floppy..

    Graham
     
    Eeyore, May 10, 2008
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. You can fdisk and format the hd using an me boot disk but it will not report
    the
    correct capacity. As soon as you start the xp install it will show the
    correct size.
    Why not just fdisk and format using the xp cd ?

    "Seeker" <2s.com> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > "Eeyore" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >>
    >>
    >> Beryl wrote:
    >>
    >>> Seeker wrote:
    >>> > "Wes Newell" <> wrote in message
    >>> > news:c30Vj.175$T1.15@trnddc01...
    >>> >> On Fri, 09 May 2008 17:01:29 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >>> >>
    >>> >>> I have a Abit AN8 Ultra motherboard with a nforce4 Ultra chipset.
    >>> >>> With
    >>> >>> the latest BIOS and drivers
    >>> >>> I have read these have a lot of problems with Sata Hard drives. I
    >>> >>> had a
    >>> >>> Samsung HD753LJ 750GB Hard Drive SATAII but fdisk and format could
    >>> >>> only
    >>> >>> find 196GB space on the disk.
    >>> >>> The BIOS showed the disk and disk size correctly. So any suggestions
    >>> >>> for
    >>> >>> SATAII Hard drives In the 500 to 750 GB range, that might work with
    >>> >>> this
    >>> >>> motherboard.
    >>> >> Hmmm... Seems to me that if the bios saw it correctly but the fdisk
    >>> >> program didn't, the problem would be with the version of fdisk you
    >>> >> are
    >>> >> using.
    >>> >>
    >>> >> --
    >>> >> Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    >>> >> My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    >>> >> Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    >>> >> AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
    >>> >
    >>> > I was using the wnME bootdisks fdisk and format.
    >>> > I thought that was the latest.
    >>>
    >>> WindowsME? That's not going to work.

    >>
    >> It IS what MS offer to boot XP systems from a floppy..
    >>
    >> Graham
    >>
    >>

    > I did try the Win XP Disk Mismanagement program and that didn't work
    > either.
    > So I sent the disk back to the supplier.
    > So I looking for recomendations for sata 3 Gbs hard disks people have got
    > to work.
    >
     
    Reggie Hillier, May 11, 2008
    #3
  4. Wes Newell

    Eeyore Guest

    Seeker wrote:

    > "Eeyore" <> wrote
    > > Beryl wrote:
    > >> Seeker wrote:
    > >> >
    > >> > I was using the wnME bootdisks fdisk and format.
    > >> > I thought that was the latest.
    > >>
    > >> WindowsME? That's not going to work.

    > >
    > > It IS what MS offer to boot XP systems from a floppy..

    >
    >
    > I did try the Win XP Disk Mismanagement program and that didn't work either.
    > So I sent the disk back to the supplier.
    > So I looking for recomendations for sata 3 Gbs hard disks people have got to
    > work.


    Do you seriously mean three gigabytes ?

    Just a thought btw. I'm not that familiar with SATA. Might the SATA interface
    chip require a device driver that's not going to be on the ME boot disk ? I've
    had no trouble Fdisking, formatting etc PATA drives using an ME boot disk.

    Graham
     
    Eeyore, May 11, 2008
    #4
  5. Wes Newell

    Eeyore Guest

    Reggie Hillier wrote:

    > Why not just fdisk and format using the xp cd ?


    Can you ? How does that work ?

    Graham
     
    Eeyore, May 11, 2008
    #5
  6. Wes Newell

    Eeyore Guest

    Beryl wrote:

    > Seeker wrote:
    >
    > > Sata drives come in 2 speeds
    > > SATA 1.5Gbps data transfer rate.
    > > SATA 3Gbps data transfer rate
    > > I was looking for a 500 to 750 GB drive running at 3 GBs
    > > I was planning on Partioning it in Win XP and formatting it in WinME format.

    >
    > Your partitions were probably too big for the ME utility to format.
    >
    > Maybe Samsung's disk manager will do exactly what you want.
    > http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/support/utilities/Support_DiskManager.html
    >
    > Looks like you'll have to select Windows ME/98/95 OSR2 to get WinME
    > (FAT32) format if that's what you want, and then it might complain that
    > ME/98/95 don't support large hard drives.


    Maybe he needs NTFS partitions ?

    In any event 'seeker' seems unwilling to provide the full info, so it's difficult to help
    him.

    Graham
     
    Eeyore, May 12, 2008
    #6
  7. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Sun, 11 May 2008 21:44:30 -0700 'Beryl'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >I saw some reviews of the Samsung HD753LJ at newegg.com, and there are
    >reports that XP takes more than 5 HOURS to format the darn thing.


    I've never used Samsung drives but plan to on my next system
    build. In the past I've always used WD and they never needed
    formatting when new.

    Are Samsung different? or is it that I use NTFS on XP, whereas
    this thread seems to be about a user wanting to format in Fat32?
     
    abit.user, May 12, 2008
    #7
  8. Wes Newell

    Folk Guest

    On Mon, 12 May 2008 14:15:29 +0100, "Seeker" <2s.com>
    wrote:

    >
    >"Eeyore" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>
    >>
    >> Beryl wrote:
    >>
    >>> Seeker wrote:
    >>>
    >>> > Sata drives come in 2 speeds
    >>> > SATA 1.5Gbps data transfer rate.
    >>> > SATA 3Gbps data transfer rate
    >>> > I was looking for a 500 to 750 GB drive running at 3 GBs
    >>> > I was planning on Partioning it in Win XP and formatting it in WinME
    >>> > format.
    >>>
    >>> Your partitions were probably too big for the ME utility to format.
    >>>
    >>> Maybe Samsung's disk manager will do exactly what you want.
    >>> http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/support/utilities/Support_DiskManager.html
    >>>
    >>> Looks like you'll have to select Windows ME/98/95 OSR2 to get WinME
    >>> (FAT32) format if that's what you want, and then it might complain that
    >>> ME/98/95 don't support large hard drives.

    >>
    >> Maybe he needs NTFS partitions ?
    >>
    >> In any event 'seeker' seems unwilling to provide the full info, so it's
    >> difficult to help
    >> him.
    >>
    >> Graham
    >>
    >>

    >
    >Sorry I forget to mention.
    >This will be my second hard drive.
    >As my existing WinXP system disk is FAT32 I have to format this FAT32 too.
    >Also I need FAT32 for access over the network.


    Retail drives usually come with a format utility on a CD that will let
    you format either NTFS or FAT32. If it's an OEM drive or didn't come
    with a CD, you can usually download a drive prep utility from the
    mfg's website.
     
    Folk, May 12, 2008
    #8
  9. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Mon, 12 May 2008 12:03:57 -0700 'Beryl'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >abit.user wrote:
    >> On Sun, 11 May 2008 21:44:30 -0700 'Beryl'
    >> wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>
    >>> I saw some reviews of the Samsung HD753LJ at newegg.com, and there are
    >>> reports that XP takes more than 5 HOURS to format the darn thing.

    >>
    >> I've never used Samsung drives but plan to on my next system
    >> build. In the past I've always used WD and they never needed
    >> formatting when new.
    >>
    >> Are Samsung different? or is it that I use NTFS on XP, whereas
    >> this thread seems to be about a user wanting to format in Fat32?

    >
    >None of my new drives (I've only bought maybe four IDE, no SATA) have
    >come formatted.
    >Seeing as you always got WD, they were probably customer returns :^)


    lol.
    I suspect that XP carries out a quick format on the fly.
     
    abit.user, May 12, 2008
    #9
  10. Wes Newell

    Wes Newell Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:

    > I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    > compatible,
    > I quote from http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >
    > "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    > your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    > forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    > Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another Hard
    > Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or NTFS.
    >
    > The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read FAT16
    > and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >
    > So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I assumed
    > the same was true over the network.


    None of this is true.

    The only thing required to access a file system on the base machine is a
    driver for it for the OS you are running. Win XP has drivers for all
    previous MS file systems, so it can access fat16, fat32, ntfs, out of the
    box and there are also hpfs, ext3, and a multitude of other file system
    drivers for it.

    As for accessing files over a network, all it needs is for the network to
    use the same protocol. The file system on either machine is irrelevant
    since the file is processed by the local machine and sent over the network
    using the network protocol.

    So you can mix your winXP drives up with any file system it supports.
    Personally, I'd format the new drive with ntfs. Back up the fat32
    partitions to it and then reformat the main drive with ntfs, and copy it
    back. Fat32 is not designed for really large drives of today and is really
    wasteful of space using 32K blocks iirc. Thus using 32K of space minimum
    even for a 10 byte file or an extra 32K block for every file on the system
    that goes over the 32K boundary by just 1 byte. This means you are
    probably wasting 30-50% of your drive space that you could recoup by
    changing to ntfs.

    --
    Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
     
    Wes Newell, May 13, 2008
    #10
  11. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100 'Seeker'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >
    >"Andy" <1@2.3> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> On Mon, 12 May 2008 14:15:29 +0100, "Seeker" <2s.com>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>>Sorry I forget to mention.
    >>>This will be my second hard drive.
    >>>As my existing WinXP system disk is FAT32 I have to format this FAT32 too.

    >> Wrong.
    >>
    >>>Also I need FAT32 for access over the network.

    >> Also wrong.
    >>
    >>>

    >>
    >> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

    >
    >I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >compatible,
    >I quote from http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >
    >"If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format your
    >Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally forwards-compatible.
    >To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on Hard drives using FAT16 will
    >not be able to access files on another Hard Drive (or partition) which has
    >been formatted using FAT32 or NTFS.
    >
    >The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read FAT16 and
    >NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >
    >So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I assumed the
    >same was true over the network.


    That is all true afaik. NTFS is the way to go IMVHO.
     
    abit.user, May 13, 2008
    #11
  12. Wes Newell

    Folk Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT, Wes Newell
    <> wrote:

    >So you can mix your winXP drives up with any file system it supports.
    >Personally, I'd format the new drive with ntfs. Back up the fat32
    >partitions to it and then reformat the main drive with ntfs, and copy it
    >back. Fat32 is not designed for really large drives of today and is really
    >wasteful of space using 32K blocks iirc. Thus using 32K of space minimum
    >even for a 10 byte file or an extra 32K block for every file on the system
    >that goes over the 32K boundary by just 1 byte. This means you are
    >probably wasting 30-50% of your drive space that you could recoup by
    >changing to ntfs.


    I run XP and my backup drive is a 500GB drive formatted in FAT32.

    The "FAT 32 wastes space" argument depends on the type of data you're
    storing. Most people don't have an abundance of tiny files on their
    system. A drive devoted to multimedia (or backups, as in my case)
    would waste virtually no space.

    FAT32 is the only choice if you plan on accessing the data via other
    operating systems such as Linux, or if you plan on manipulating the
    data using something like a DOS boot disk (which is why my backup
    drive is FAT32... if I need to recover a blown drive, it's a lot
    easier to restore from a FAT32 drive using low-level utilities).

    And you can't "format the main drive in NTFS and copy back". That
    just doesn't work for a boot drive. You *can* use XP's built in
    "convert to NTFS" utility, but most people would advise against that
    also.

    The OP's system is running fine using FAT32 so why suggest he jump
    through a bunch of hoops to get to NTFS?
     
    Folk, May 13, 2008
    #12
  13. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT 'Wes Newell'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >
    >> I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >> compatible,
    >> I quote from http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >>
    >> "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    >> your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    >> forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    >> Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another Hard
    >> Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or NTFS.
    >>
    >> The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read FAT16
    >> and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >>
    >> So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I assumed
    >> the same was true over the network.



    >None of this is true.


    NTFS and FAT32 are backwards compatible.
    They are not forward compatible.

    You seem to have a problem understanding what the previous poster
    was trying to explain.
     
    abit.user, May 13, 2008
    #13
  14. Wes Newell

    Wes Newell Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 13:31:20 -0400, Folk wrote:

    > On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT, Wes Newell
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>So you can mix your winXP drives up with any file system it supports.
    >>Personally, I'd format the new drive with ntfs. Back up the fat32
    >>partitions to it and then reformat the main drive with ntfs, and copy it
    >>back. Fat32 is not designed for really large drives of today and is
    >>really wasteful of space using 32K blocks iirc. Thus using 32K of space
    >>minimum even for a 10 byte file or an extra 32K block for every file on
    >>the system that goes over the 32K boundary by just 1 byte. This means
    >>you are probably wasting 30-50% of your drive space that you could
    >>recoup by changing to ntfs.

    >
    > I run XP and my backup drive is a 500GB drive formatted in FAT32.
    >

    My backup is a JFS formatted raid0 pair of drives.

    > The "FAT 32 wastes space" argument depends on the type of data you're
    > storing. Most people don't have an abundance of tiny files on their
    > system. A drive devoted to multimedia (or backups, as in my case) would
    > waste virtually no space.
    >

    True, the larger the file, the less wasted space, but XP has thousands of
    files. He's wasting lots of space with just the base install assuming it's
    using 32K blocks.

    > FAT32 is the only choice if you plan on accessing the data via other
    > operating systems such as Linux, or if you plan on manipulating the data
    > using something like a DOS boot disk (which is why my backup drive is
    > FAT32... if I need to recover a blown drive, it's a lot easier to
    > restore from a FAT32 drive using low-level utilities).
    >

    Well, I don't have that problem since I don't run MS OS's. And I could
    read/write NTFS if I had an ntfs partition. :)

    > And you can't "format the main drive in NTFS and copy back". That just
    > doesn't work for a boot drive. You *can* use XP's built in "convert to
    > NTFS" utility, but most people would advise against that also.
    >

    So it's even easier than copying the system. BTW, I've copied windows
    drives before and didn't have a problem getting them to boot.

    > The OP's system is running fine using FAT32 so why suggest he jump
    > through a bunch of hoops to get to NTFS?


    Jump through what hoops? You just said XP will convert the system to NTFS
    automatically.:)




    --
    Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
     
    Wes Newell, May 13, 2008
    #14
  15. Wes Newell

    Wes Newell Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 21:06:52 +0100, abit.user wrote:

    > On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    > alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >
    >>On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >>
    >>> I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >>> compatible,
    >>> I quote from http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >>>
    >>> "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    >>> your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    >>> forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    >>> Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another
    >>> Hard Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or
    >>> NTFS.
    >>>
    >>> The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read FAT16
    >>> and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >>>
    >>> So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I
    >>> assumed the same was true over the network.

    >
    >
    >>None of this is true.

    >
    > NTFS and FAT32 are backwards compatible. They are not forward
    > compatible.
    >
    > You seem to have a problem understanding what the previous poster was
    > trying to explain.


    I understand he's running XP, which supports both fat32 and ntfs. There's
    nothing else to understand.

    --
    Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
     
    Wes Newell, May 13, 2008
    #15
  16. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 22:00:57 GMT 'Wes Newell'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >On Tue, 13 May 2008 21:06:52 +0100, abit.user wrote:
    >
    >> On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >> alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>
    >>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >>>> compatible,
    >>>> I quote from http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >>>>
    >>>> "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    >>>> your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    >>>> forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    >>>> Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another
    >>>> Hard Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or
    >>>> NTFS.
    >>>>
    >>>> The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read FAT16
    >>>> and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >>>>
    >>>> So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I
    >>>> assumed the same was true over the network.

    >>
    >>
    >>>None of this is true.



    >> NTFS and FAT32 are backwards compatible. They are not forward
    >> compatible.
    >>
    >> You seem to have a problem understanding what the previous poster was
    >> trying to explain.



    >I understand he's running XP, which supports both fat32 and ntfs. There's
    >nothing else to understand.


    Wrong, again.

    Seeker wrote:
    "So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions..."

    Which made your response wrong, as I alluded to, since it also
    means that if he installs NTFS on his other drive, the FAT32 XP
    system won't see it.

    He could of course convert to NTFS on all of them.

    Hope that clears it up...
     
    abit.user, May 13, 2008
    #16
  17. Wes Newell

    Wes Newell Guest

    On Tue, 13 May 2008 23:50:40 +0100, abit.user wrote:

    > On Tue, 13 May 2008 22:00:57 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    > alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >
    >>On Tue, 13 May 2008 21:06:52 +0100, abit.user wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >>> alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>>
    >>>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >>>>> compatible,
    >>>>> I quote from
    >>>>> http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >>>>>
    >>>>> "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    >>>>> your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    >>>>> forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    >>>>> Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another
    >>>>> Hard Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or
    >>>>> NTFS.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read
    >>>>> FAT16 and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >>>>>
    >>>>> So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I
    >>>>> assumed the same was true over the network.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>None of this is true.

    >
    >
    >>> NTFS and FAT32 are backwards compatible. They are not forward
    >>> compatible.
    >>>
    >>> You seem to have a problem understanding what the previous poster was
    >>> trying to explain.

    >
    >
    >>I understand he's running XP, which supports both fat32 and ntfs.
    >>There's nothing else to understand.

    >
    > Wrong, again.
    >
    > Seeker wrote:
    > "So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions..."
    >
    > Which made your response wrong, as I alluded to, since it also means
    > that if he installs NTFS on his other drive, the FAT32 XP system won't
    > see it.
    >
    > He could of course convert to NTFS on all of them.
    >
    > Hope that clears it up...


    So, you're saying win xp can't support both ntfs and fat 32 on the same
    system? Somehow, even as bad a MS crap is, I find that hard to believe. In
    fact I find it really stupid.

    --
    Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
     
    Wes Newell, May 14, 2008
    #17
  18. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Wed, 14 May 2008 06:21:06 GMT 'Wes Newell'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >On Tue, 13 May 2008 23:50:40 +0100, abit.user wrote:
    >
    >> On Tue, 13 May 2008 22:00:57 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >> alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>
    >>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 21:06:52 +0100, abit.user wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >>>> alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>>>
    >>>>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >>>>>> compatible,
    >>>>>> I quote from
    >>>>>> http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    >>>>>> your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    >>>>>> forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    >>>>>> Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another
    >>>>>> Hard Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or
    >>>>>> NTFS.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read
    >>>>>> FAT16 and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I
    >>>>>> assumed the same was true over the network.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>None of this is true.

    >>
    >>
    >>>> NTFS and FAT32 are backwards compatible. They are not forward
    >>>> compatible.
    >>>>
    >>>> You seem to have a problem understanding what the previous poster was
    >>>> trying to explain.

    >>
    >>
    >>>I understand he's running XP, which supports both fat32 and ntfs.
    >>>There's nothing else to understand.

    >>
    >> Wrong, again.
    >>
    >> Seeker wrote:
    >> "So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions..."
    >>
    >> Which made your response wrong, as I alluded to, since it also means
    >> that if he installs NTFS on his other drive, the FAT32 XP system won't
    >> see it.
    >>
    >> He could of course convert to NTFS on all of them.
    >>
    >> Hope that clears it up...

    >
    >So, you're saying win xp can't support both ntfs and fat 32 on the same
    >system? Somehow, even as bad a MS crap is, I find that hard to believe. In
    >fact I find it really stupid.


    Nope. I simply said that FAT32 cannot access an NTFS drive.
    The reason is that both are only backwards compatible, not
    forwards compatible. Thus, NTFS being the most recent, it
    can access a FAT32 drive but not the other way round.

    Both can co-exist on the same system with that limitation.

    That's quite well explained in various places.
     
    abit.user, May 14, 2008
    #18
  19. Wes Newell

    abit.user Guest

    On Wed, 14 May 2008 14:46:12 +0100 'Seeker'
    wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

    >"abit.user" <> wrote in message
    >news:de98e1f7fec662cb2ad51231a4a18ed5@localhost.127.0.0.1...
    >>
    >> On Wed, 14 May 2008 06:21:06 GMT 'Wes Newell'
    >> wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>
    >>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 23:50:40 +0100, abit.user wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Tue, 13 May 2008 22:00:57 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >>>> alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>>>
    >>>>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 21:06:52 +0100, abit.user wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2008 16:12:48 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >>>>>> alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>>On Tue, 13 May 2008 14:53:12 +0100, Seeker wrote:
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I have seen many comments that the file system type is not forward
    >>>>>>>> compatible,
    >>>>>>>> I quote from
    >>>>>>>> http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/pc-articles/fdisk-format/
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "If you have the opportunity to select a system from these to format
    >>>>>>>> your Hard Disk, be aware that these system are not generally
    >>>>>>>> forwards-compatible. To clarify this, Operating Systems installed on
    >>>>>>>> Hard drives using FAT16 will not be able to access files on another
    >>>>>>>> Hard Drive (or partition) which has been formatted using FAT32 or
    >>>>>>>> NTFS.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> The same can be said for FAT32 and NTFS. However, FAT32 can read
    >>>>>>>> FAT16 and NTFS is clever enough to read both FAT16 and FAT32."
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions I
    >>>>>>>> assumed the same was true over the network.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>>None of this is true.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>> NTFS and FAT32 are backwards compatible. They are not forward
    >>>>>> compatible.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> You seem to have a problem understanding what the previous poster was
    >>>>>> trying to explain.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>I understand he's running XP, which supports both fat32 and ntfs.
    >>>>>There's nothing else to understand.
    >>>>
    >>>> Wrong, again.
    >>>>
    >>>> Seeker wrote:
    >>>> "So believing my FAT32 Win XP could not access NTFS partitions..."
    >>>>
    >>>> Which made your response wrong, as I alluded to, since it also means
    >>>> that if he installs NTFS on his other drive, the FAT32 XP system won't
    >>>> see it.
    >>>>
    >>>> He could of course convert to NTFS on all of them.
    >>>>
    >>>> Hope that clears it up...
    >>>
    >>>So, you're saying win xp can't support both ntfs and fat 32 on the same
    >>>system? Somehow, even as bad a MS crap is, I find that hard to believe. In
    >>>fact I find it really stupid.



    >> Nope. I simply said that FAT32 cannot access an NTFS drive.
    >> The reason is that both are only backwards compatible, not
    >> forwards compatible. Thus, NTFS being the most recent, it
    >> can access a FAT32 drive but not the other way round.
    >>
    >> Both can co-exist on the same system with that limitation.
    >>
    >> That's quite well explained in various places.

    >
    >So what is the chance of Windows Convert working on my XP Fat32 system disk.
    >I was planning on a big partition and a smaller fat32 partition to try Linux
    >on.
    >I could back up onto the fat32 partition.


    I've never used the Windows convert tool ( I've always used
    XP with NTFS ) but MS provide it and presumably it works.
    I wouldn't wish to use it without first backing up or imaging
    my data! ...and doing a full defrag afterwards.

    My general advice would be to always try to use NTFS since it's
    a far better file system than FAT32 ... more robust, faster,
    with additional features and can recognise larger partitions.

    Depending how much free space you have on the FAT32, you could
    consider partitioning it to create a second FAT32 partition for
    Linux and then covert what's left to NTFS for XP.
     
    abit.user, May 14, 2008
    #19
  20. Wes Newell

    Wes Newell Guest

    On Wed, 14 May 2008 12:08:29 +0100, abit.user wrote:

    > On Wed, 14 May 2008 06:21:06 GMT 'Wes Newell' wrote this on
    >>So, you're saying win xp can't support both ntfs and fat 32 on the same
    >>system? Somehow, even as bad a MS crap is, I find that hard to believe.
    >>In fact I find it really stupid.

    >
    > Nope. I simply said that FAT32 cannot access an NTFS drive. The reason
    > is that both are only backwards compatible, not forwards compatible.
    > Thus, NTFS being the most recent, it can access a FAT32 drive but not
    > the other way round.
    >
    > Both can co-exist on the same system with that limitation.
    >
    > That's quite well explained in various places.


    To be honest, I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about.
    File systems can't access other file systems. The OS and underlying
    drivers are what access a file system. So it doesn't matter how many
    different files systems you have as long as the OS you run has a driver
    for it. I know I can access fat12, fat16, fat32, ntfs, hpfs, ext2/3,
    reiser, xfs, jfs, and about 20-40 more different file systems. Running XP.
    he could certainly format the new drive with NTFS and access it even
    though XP is running off a fat32 formatted partition. It simply doesn't
    matter. As for backups, he can back it up to any file system he wants.

    --
    Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
    My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
    Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
    AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
     
    Wes Newell, May 14, 2008
    #20
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