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Sun Blade 1000 SCSI DVD/CD problem......

Discussion in 'Sun Hardware' started by John Burns, Aug 18, 2009.

  1. John Burns

    John Burns Guest

    I have a Blade 1000 that won't recognise any SCSI DVD/CD drives I
    connect to it's internal 50 pin SCSI cable. I'm using probe-scsi from
    the bios prompt.

    I've tried a Toshiba DVD from a similar machine and an older Toshiba CD.
    Both are on ID 6 with terminaton off and parity on. Drives work fine on
    other unix boxes.

    It sees it's internal hard drive OK.

    Any ideas?


    --
    Who needs a life when you've got Unix? :)
    Email: , John G.Burns B.Eng, Bonny Scotland
    Web : http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk - The Ultimate BMW Homepage!
    Need Sun or HP Unix kit? http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.html
    www.Strathspey.co.uk - Quality Binoculars at a Sensible price
     
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  2. Bart

    Bart Guest

    On Aug 18, 7:38 am, John Burns <> wrote:
    > I have a Blade 1000 that won't recognise any SCSI DVD/CD drives I
    > connect to it's internal 50 pin SCSI cable. I'm using probe-scsi from
    > the bios prompt.
    >
    > I've tried a Toshiba DVD from a similar machine and an older Toshiba CD.
    > Both are on ID 6 with terminaton off and parity on. Drives work fine on
    > other unix boxes.
    >
    > It sees it's internal hard drive OK.
    >
    > Any ideas?
    >
    > --
    > Who needs a life when you've got Unix? :)  
    > Email: , John G.Burns B.Eng, Bonny Scotland
    > Web  :http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk- The Ultimate BMW Homepage!
    > Need Sun or HP Unix kit?http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.htmlwww.Strathspey.co.uk- Quality Binoculars at a Sensible price


    In my experience, not all SCSI CD-ROMS/DVD drives work in Sun boxes.
    I've tried a couple of 4x and 16x from various Apple machines I had
    and they never worked, although they work fine on HP and IBM boxes.

    However the 16x from my Ultra 60 worked fine in my sunblade 2k.
    Pretty sure there is some info on the web about block structure
    requirements etc. and you'll need a sun compatible drive.
     
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  3. DoN. Nichols

    DoN. Nichols Guest

    On 2009-08-18, John Burns <> wrote:
    > I have a Blade 1000 that won't recognise any SCSI DVD/CD drives I
    > connect to it's internal 50 pin SCSI cable. I'm using probe-scsi from
    > the bios prompt.
    >
    > I've tried a Toshiba DVD from a similar machine and an older Toshiba CD.
    > Both are on ID 6 with terminaton off and parity on. Drives work fine on
    > other unix boxes.


    Do you have the proper Sun cable with the terminator pack at the
    drive end?

    And have you tried "probe-scsi-all" instead? I forget whether
    probe-scsi bothers to look at anything other than the FC-AL bus
    (internal disk drives and possible external FC-AL drives).

    > It sees it's internal hard drive OK.


    Yes -- but that is on the FC-AL bus, even though it is called
    "SCSI" by the probe utility. "probe-scsi-all" sees all three buses
    (internal CD-ROM drive, FC-AL drives, and external 68-pin SCSI (which is
    a separate bus from the internal ones), plus any others on cards plugged
    into the PCI slots.

    Good Luck,
    DoN.

    --
    Email: <> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
    (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
    --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
     
  4. DoN. Nichols

    DoN. Nichols Guest

    On 2009-08-18, Bart <> wrote:
    > On Aug 18, 7:38 am, John Burns <> wrote:
    >> I have a Blade 1000 that won't recognise any SCSI DVD/CD drives I
    >> connect to it's internal 50 pin SCSI cable. I'm using probe-scsi from
    >> the bios prompt.
    >>
    >> I've tried a Toshiba DVD from a similar machine and an older Toshiba CD.
    >> Both are on ID 6 with terminaton off and parity on. Drives work fine on
    >> other unix boxes.
    >>
    >> It sees it's internal hard drive OK.
    >>
    >> Any ideas?
    >>
    >> --
    >> Who needs a life when you've got Unix? :)  
    >> Email: , John G.Burns B.Eng, Bonny Scotland
    >> Web  :http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk- The Ultimate BMW Homepage!
    >> Need Sun or HP Unix kit?http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.htmlwww.Strathspey.co.uk- Quality Binoculars at a Sensible price

    >
    > In my experience, not all SCSI CD-ROMS/DVD drives work in Sun boxes.
    > I've tried a couple of 4x and 16x from various Apple machines I had
    > and they never worked, although they work fine on HP and IBM boxes.
    >
    > However the 16x from my Ultra 60 worked fine in my sunblade 2k.
    > Pretty sure there is some info on the web about block structure
    > requirements etc. and you'll need a sun compatible drive.


    That applies when booting from the drive -- but probe-scsi-all
    should at leat *see* it.

    Two things apply when booting:

    1) The default block size needs to be 512 bytes, instead of 2048
    bytes which is the default for many non-Sun supplied ones. Once
    the system is booted, it has a more complex driver, which can
    tell the drive to switch to 512 byte block sizes. And I *think*
    that the SB-1K/SB-2K/SF-280R systems are smart enough to tell
    the drives even from the boot command.

    2) If you are trying to boot from a DVD-ROM, instead of a CD-ROM
    you need the latest firmware (downloadable from Sun) for the
    Toshiba drives which were in everything from the Ultra-1 up
    through the SB-2k at least. Here is what the output of
    "cdrecord -scanbus" shows -- I have the drive in question moved
    to an external bus, and have installed an IDE DVD+/-RW drive
    with a bridge card by ACard to make it both a bootable drive and
    a read-write drive.

    5,6,0 506) 'TOSHIBA ' 'DVD-ROM SD-M1401' '1009' Removable CD-ROM

    "probe-scsi-all" will show the model "M1401" and the firmware
    version "1009" squished together in some format -- but it *must*
    be the "1009" firmware version to boot from a DVD-ROM.

    Note that I have seen one system with a bad internal SCSI bus,
    and this may be one -- or it may simply be that the OP needs
    "probe-scsi-all" instead of "probe-scsi" to see the drive.

    That one system with the bad internal SCSI bus could be booted
    from the same drive moved to an external box connected to the external
    68-pin SCSI. It did require a devalias invocation to work for booting,
    which I accomplished via the following two additions to the "printenv"
    at the OBP level:

    ======================================================================
    use-nvramrc?=true
    nvramrc=devalias cdrom1 /pc1@8,700000/scsi@2,1/disk@6,0:f
    ======================================================================

    Note that the early part of that may need changing based on
    information from "probe-scsi-all", and you have to type:

    boot cdrom1

    instead of

    boot cdrom

    to use it. My example has the drive connected to an extra PCI card, not
    to the built-in external SCSI bus.

    In any case, the string will have to end with "/disk@?,0:f",
    where '?' corresponds to the SCSI ID of the drive -- jumper or swich on
    the external box.

    I hope that this helps,
    DoN.

    --
    Email: <> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
    (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
    --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
     
  5. Gert Doering

    Gert Doering Guest

    "DoN. Nichols" <> writes:

    >2) If you are trying to boot from a DVD-ROM, instead of a CD-ROM
    > you need the latest firmware (downloadable from Sun) for the
    > Toshiba drives which were in everything from the Ultra-1 up
    > through the SB-2k at least.


    How does one upgrade the firmware in a DVD-ROM from Solaris?

    gert
    --
    Yield to temptation ... it may not pass your way again! -- Lazarus Long
    //www.muc.de/~gert
    Gert Doering - Munich, Germany
    fax: +49-89-3243328 -muenchen.de
     
  6. David Wilson

    David Wilson Guest

    On Aug 19, 4:53 pm, (Gert Doering) wrote:
    > "DoN. Nichols" <> writes:
    > >2)  If you are trying to boot from a DVD-ROM, instead of a CD-ROM
    > >    you need the latest firmware (downloadable from Sun) for the
    > >    Toshiba drives which were in everything from the Ultra-1 up
    > >    through the SB-2k at least.  

    >
    > How does one upgrade the firmware in a DVD-ROM from Solaris?


    A quick grep of Sun's xref file indicates to me that installing patch
    111649-04 would upgrade the firmware of the DVD drive.

    111649|04|May/19/05| | | | |Unbundled|||Hardware/DVD: Toshiba DVD
    1401 firmware
     
  7. DoN. Nichols

    DoN. Nichols Guest

    On 2009-08-19, Gert Doering <> wrote:
    > "DoN. Nichols" <> writes:
    >
    >>2) If you are trying to boot from a DVD-ROM, instead of a CD-ROM
    >> you need the latest firmware (downloadable from Sun) for the
    >> Toshiba drives which were in everything from the Ultra-1 up
    >> through the SB-2k at least.

    >
    > How does one upgrade the firmware in a DVD-ROM from Solaris?


    You search for the patch "111649-04" on Sun's site (it will
    proably be a compressed tar file), extract it, read the README file
    included, and follow the instructions:

    ======================================================================
    -r--r--r-- 1 dnichols family 93 May 16 2005 copyright
    -r--r--r-- 1 dnichols family 13K Sep 27 2005 LEGAL_LICENSE.TXT
    -r--r--r-- 1 dnichols family 5.6K Aug 27 2001 License
    -rwxr-xr-x 1 dnichols family 55K Aug 27 2001 optdload*
    -rw-r--r-- 1 dnichols family 8.8K Mar 9 2006 README.111649-04
    -r--r--r-- 1 dnichols family 116K Aug 27 2001 Yg1009.hex
    ======================================================================

    When I downloaded it, it was free -- and I hope that it still
    is. I've used mine quite a few times since I got the patch.

    The README shows yet another way to view the version of the
    DVD-ROM drive:

    iostat -E | grep DVD

    Enjoy,
    DoN.

    --
    Email: <> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
    (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
    --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
     
  8. John Burns

    John Burns Guest

  9. DoN. Nichols

    DoN. Nichols Guest

    On 2009-08-20, John Burns <> wrote:
    > Thanks for the advice guys :)


    You're welcome.

    >> --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

    >
    > cool sig :)


    Thanks! It came from a button I got at a Science Fiction
    Convention many years ago. I've never been able to find out who
    originally said it. The button maker did not know.

    Enjoy,
    DoN.

    --
    Email: <> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
    (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
    --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
     
  10. Dave

    Dave Guest

    DoN. Nichols wrote:
    > On 2009-08-18, Bart <> wrote:
    >> On Aug 18, 7:38 am, John Burns <> wrote:
    >>> I have a Blade 1000 that won't recognise any SCSI DVD/CD drives I
    >>> connect to it's internal 50 pin SCSI cable. I'm using probe-scsi from
    >>> the bios prompt.
    >>>
    >>> I've tried a Toshiba DVD from a similar machine and an older Toshiba CD.
    >>> Both are on ID 6 with terminaton off and parity on. Drives work fine on
    >>> other unix boxes.
    >>>
    >>> It sees it's internal hard drive OK.
    >>>
    >>> Any ideas?
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> Who needs a life when you've got Unix? :)
    >>> Email: , John G.Burns B.Eng, Bonny Scotland
    >>> Web :http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk- The Ultimate BMW Homepage!
    >>> Need Sun or HP Unix kit?http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.htmlwww.Strathspey.co.uk- Quality Binoculars at a Sensible price

    >> In my experience, not all SCSI CD-ROMS/DVD drives work in Sun boxes.
    >> I've tried a couple of 4x and 16x from various Apple machines I had
    >> and they never worked, although they work fine on HP and IBM boxes.
    >>
    >> However the 16x from my Ultra 60 worked fine in my sunblade 2k.
    >> Pretty sure there is some info on the web about block structure
    >> requirements etc. and you'll need a sun compatible drive.

    >
    > That applies when booting from the drive -- but probe-scsi-all
    > should at leat *see* it.
    >
    > Two things apply when booting:
    >
    > 1) The default block size needs to be 512 bytes, instead of 2048
    > bytes which is the default for many non-Sun supplied ones. Once
    > the system is booted, it has a more complex driver, which can
    > tell the drive to switch to 512 byte block sizes. And I *think*
    > that the SB-1K/SB-2K/SF-280R systems are smart enough to tell
    > the drives even from the boot command.


    I used a SCSI->IDE converted in my Blade 2000 (basically the same
    machine as a 1000). That worked fine, and allowed me to use a double
    layer DVD drive. I never set the block size on that SCSI->IDE converter
    (I'm not even sure I could have done so), but it worked fine. So I think
    the Blade 2000 is smart enough to work with anything.

    An obvious problem could be a faulty terminator or cable. If John has an
    external enclosure which would take the drive, I would be tempted to
    make it an external device and see if that works. If so, it would
    suggest the drive is suitable, but a cable issue.
     
  11. DoN. Nichols

    DoN. Nichols Guest

    On 2009-08-26, Dave <> wrote:
    > DoN. Nichols wrote:
    >> On 2009-08-18, Bart <> wrote:
    >>> On Aug 18, 7:38 am, John Burns <> wrote:
    >>>> I have a Blade 1000 that won't recognise any SCSI DVD/CD drives I
    >>>> connect to it's internal 50 pin SCSI cable. I'm using probe-scsi from
    >>>> the bios prompt.
    >>>>
    >>>> I've tried a Toshiba DVD from a similar machine and an older Toshiba CD.
    >>>> Both are on ID 6 with terminaton off and parity on. Drives work fine on
    >>>> other unix boxes.
    >>>>
    >>>> It sees it's internal hard drive OK.


    Hmm ... seeing its internal hard drive does not count. On the
    SB-1000, SB-2000 and Sun Fire 280R, that is an FC-AL drive with a
    different internal bus and controller. The SB-1000, SB-2000, and
    SF-280R have two SCSI buses on a single chip. One is the internal scsi
    bus for the DVD-ROM and an optional internal tape. The other is the
    external 68-pin SCSI for whatever you may hang on it. I don't know
    whether the line drivers are part of that chip, or are additional logic.
    (Schematics of the board are rather in the same category as hen's
    teeth.) I'm not even sure which chip *is* the dual SCSI host adaptor.

    Now -- if you plugged a 50-pin SCSI hard drive where the DVD-ROM
    drive is, and it sees that, but does not see the DVD-ROM, then you have
    a strange failure indeed.

    >>>> Any ideas?
    >>>>
    >>>> --
    >>>> Who needs a life when you've got Unix? :)
    >>>> Email: , John G.Burns B.Eng, Bonny Scotland
    >>>> Web :http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk- The Ultimate BMW Homepage!
    >>>> Need Sun or HP Unix kit?http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.htmlwww.Strathspey.co.uk- Quality Binoculars at a Sensible price
    >>> In my experience, not all SCSI CD-ROMS/DVD drives work in Sun boxes.
    >>> I've tried a couple of 4x and 16x from various Apple machines I had
    >>> and they never worked, although they work fine on HP and IBM boxes.
    >>>
    >>> However the 16x from my Ultra 60 worked fine in my sunblade 2k.
    >>> Pretty sure there is some info on the web about block structure
    >>> requirements etc. and you'll need a sun compatible drive.

    >>
    >> That applies when booting from the drive -- but probe-scsi-all
    >> should at least *see* it.
    >>
    >> Two things apply when booting:
    >>
    >> 1) The default block size needs to be 512 bytes, instead of 2048
    >> bytes which is the default for many non-Sun supplied ones. Once
    >> the system is booted, it has a more complex driver, which can
    >> tell the drive to switch to 512 byte block sizes. And I *think*
    >> that the SB-1K/SB-2K/SF-280R systems are smart enough to tell
    >> the drives even from the boot command.

    >
    > I used a SCSI->IDE converted in my Blade 2000 (basically the same
    > machine as a 1000).


    The Sun Fire 280R is also the same machine, except in a
    horizontal format for rack mounting. Minor differences, such as the
    internal FC-AL disks being 0 and 1, instead of 1 and 2, and the Firewire
    connectors are blocked on the 280R.

    > That worked fine, and allowed me to use a double
    > layer DVD drive.


    Does this include booting from it? I am also using a IDE R/+/-W
    DVD drive:

    ======================================================================
    '_NEC ' 'DVD_RW ND-3520A ' '1.04' Removable CD-ROM
    ======================================================================

    with an ACARD IDE->50pinSCSI bridge card, and I have verified that I can
    boot from it. I recently installed the most recent Solaris 10 from DVDs
    with no problems, so it does boot from that -- suggesting that the OBP
    is now smart enough to request a change to 512 byte block size -- or to
    boot from 2048 byte blocks. :)

    I also have the original:

    ======================================================================
    'TOSHIBA ' 'DVD-ROM SD-M1401' '1009' Removable CD-ROM
    ======================================================================

    drive in an external box, and have set up a devalias in the OBP so I can
    boot from it as well:

    ======================================================================
    nvramrc=devalias cdrom1 /pc1@8,700000/scsi@2,1/disk@6,0:f
    ======================================================================

    This one works in my setup -- but you might need to modify it depending
    on which bus you connect it to. IIRC, this is connected to a dual SCSI
    SE/LVD card in one of the PCI instead of the 68-pin external SCSI bus on
    the system card, so you would need a different path. Look at the path
    listed by devalias at the OBP level, and see what the one is for the
    internal cdrom. It will be the same path, but a "scsi@?,1" if the one for
    the internal cdrom alias is "scsi@?" without the ",1".

    Anyway -- you type "boot cdrom1" instead of "boot cdrom" for he
    external one.

    Yep -- I just checked, and the only thing hooked to the system
    board's external 68-pin SCSI is an old HP C5110A ScanJet, which works
    nicely with SANE.

    > I never set the block size on that SCSI->IDE converter
    > (I'm not even sure I could have done so), but it worked fine. So I think
    > the Blade 2000 is smart enough to work with anything.


    In particular, it is the OBP which needs to be smart enough for
    booting, while the OS can handle things much more complex. (IIRC, the
    OBP firmware had to be updated to boot from DVD-ROMs as well in earlier
    systems like the Ultra-60.

    > An obvious problem could be a faulty terminator or cable.


    I have encountered a system where the half of the on-board SCSI
    which talked to the internal SCSI was bad. This was why I learned how
    to configure for booting from an external drive.

    > If John has an
    > external enclosure which would take the drive, I would be tempted to
    > make it an external device and see if that works. If so, it would
    > suggest the drive is suitable, but a cable issue.


    The cable, or the on-board SCSI host adaptor. It was the
    availability of a spare internal cable with built-in terminator which
    enabled me to diagnose the bad internal SCSI, when neither cable worked,
    neither of two drives worked internally, but either drive would work in
    an external housing on the 68-pin external SCSI bus.

    Enjoy,
    DoN.

    --
    Email: <> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
    (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
    --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
     
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