Can 3 burners be installed on P5LD2 Deluxe Mobo

Discussion in 'Asus' started by Jackpine, Apr 27, 2006.

  1. Jackpine

    Jackpine Guest

    I am toying with the idea of installing two DVD burners and one C
    burner on my PC. I understand that when installing one DVD-RW an
    one CD-RW, they are both connected to one cable which plugs into th
    blue PRI_IDE connector

    Can I install a second DVD-RW burner? If so, where? There is one re
    PRI_EIDE connector and one red SEC_EIDE connector. Is that were i
    goes? (According to the mobo manual, those connectors do not suppor
    ATAPI devices, which I believe the optical drives are.

    What about the issue of MASTER and SLAVE? Do each of the thre
    burners have to be designated something

    Thanks for any assistance
    Jackpine, Apr 27, 2006
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  2. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    If your motherboard has two IDE connectors then you can have up to four IDE
    devices, including up to four DVD/CDs. If it has only one, as some current
    boards do because of the trend towards SATA, you can buy a PCI IDE card to
    increase the number of IDE connectors.

    Each IDE channel supports two devices, a master and a slave. If possible
    use two masters so that the devices use separate channels, whereas a
    master/slave arrangement will involve competition for the channel and that
    can be bad for DVD/CD burning.

    Master/slave status involves two things, the jumper configuration on the
    device, and if you are using Ultra-DMA (as all modern pcs do) then the
    devices must be attached to the cable in a specific order. The old 40-pin
    IDE ribbon-cable connectors were all black and it didn't matter which device
    connector you used for which device. The 80-pin Ultra-DMA cable connectors
    are coloured: blue for the motherboard/IDE host; grey for the slave; and
    black for the master. If your device jumpers have a CSEL (Cable Select)
    setting then the device will autodect whether it is a master or a slave
    according to which connector it's attached to, otherwise set the jumpers
    appropriately. Attaching a master device to a grey connector or a slave to
    a black will result in failure.

    Lastly remember to go into Device Manager and check that your IDE
    controllers (Properties > Advanced tab) are set for DMA. If they are using
    PIO your performance will be awful.
    DRS, Apr 27, 2006
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  3. Jackpine

    R Guest

    I don't know if you've purchased all 3 yet; but many new burners are
    available (and faster I believe) in the SATA flavor.
    R, Apr 27, 2006
  4. Jackpine

    Jackpine Guest

    If your motherboard has two IDE connectors then you can have up t
    four IDE
    My mobo has one PRI_IDE connector, one PRI_EIDE connector, and on
    SEC_EIDE connector. From what you say above, I will need to instal
    a PCI IDE card. What are the two EIDE connectors for
    With what I have now, I will install 2 burners, connected to th
    single PRI_IDE connector that is on the board. It is not clear to m
    from what you say above. Should they both be set to Master

    If I install a PCI IDE card and install a third burner, I will the
    have two burners on one IDE channel, and one burner on a second ID
    channel. What will the master/slave settings be in that case
    Jackpine, Apr 27, 2006
  5. Jackpine

    Jackpine Guest

    I have purchased the following

    Lite-On 52x32x52x16x CDRW + DVD Combo Driv

    Lite-On 16x Double Layer DVD+/-RW Driv

    If a go the 3 burner route, I will purchase another Lite-ON DVD+/-R

    Can you give me any guidance regarding my questions about which devic
    is Master and Slave for 2 burner installation (DVD and CD on on
    cable), and for 3 burner installation (DVD and CD on one cable, an
    another DVD on a second cable)
    Jackpine, Apr 27, 2006
  6. Jackpine

    FeMaster Guest

    From what I have read in the manual, you are limited to 2 drives, as you
    suspected. The EIDE connectors are strictly for Hard Drives only... As
    another poster stated, you would need to purchase an IDE PCI card. These
    are fairly cheap investments, and would then allow for another 4 devices to
    be connected to your system... Stick with the two units you have now until
    you can invest in the right PCI card.

    As far as master and slave, I'd make your DVD burner the master drive, and
    the CD burner the slave drive.

    Just out of curiosity, why do you want such a setup? You do realize that
    DVD burners can burn CDs as well, correct?
    FeMaster, Apr 27, 2006
  7. Doesn't matter how many burners you have total, it's only 2 burners or HDs
    per cable anyway. On one cable you have 1 master and 1 slave period (3rd
    connector to controller).

    So in your case with 2 burners on pri-IDE, it would be DVD-RW as master,
    DVD/CD-RW as slave..
    With an additional IDE controller card, it's the same + a master on the IDE
    card's 1st IDE channel.

    If you're using WinXP, remeber that you can only burn CDs with XP tools,
    DVDs are not supported. And only one burner can be active ("burnable") at a
    time, set by the device's properties page....DVDs need 3rd party tools

    (CD/DVD players/burners are usually not ATAPI compliant, so the PRI-EIDE and
    SEC-EIDE on your mobo are for HDs only, usually in RAID configuration)

    Most learned on these newsgroups
    Helsinki, FINLAND
    (translations from/to FI not always accurate
    Thomas Wendell, Apr 27, 2006
  8. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    It sounds like you have an older motherboard. EIDE stands for Enhanced IDE.
    It supports ATA-2 and ATAPI. Use EIDE in preference to IDE. (Current
    motherboards support Ultra-ATA, aka Ultra-DMA, which is an extention of
    ATA-2 and ATA-3). Being ATAPI devices, I doubt your DVD/CDs would work on
    40-pin IDE anyway (but if they do performance will be woeful). So from this
    point on I'm forgetting your IDE connector even exists.

    The two EIDE connectors (or ports) will handle two devices each, exactly as
    I described earlier for IDE. Only faster.
    Connect one to EIDE1 (Primary EIDE) as the master and the other to EIDE2
    (Secondary EDIE) as the master. That way they will use different channels
    and not compete for bandwidth.
    The first device on EIDE1 will be the master and the second the slave. The
    device on EIDE2 should be the master. BTW, what sort of hard disk do you
    have? How is it connected?
    Bandwidth for burning matters more than bandwidth for reading. IOW, if
    you're reading a DVD at 16 times and that slows down a bit for some reason
    it's not a disaster. If you're burning at maximum speed and there's
    bandwidth contention then that can be bad, buffer under-run protection

    Therefore I would put one DVD RW as the Primary master, the CD/DVD as
    Primary slave, and the second DVD RW as the Secondary Master. By keeping
    the burners on separate channels you could theoretically burn two disks at
    once, or copy a disc from the DVD/CD on the Primary channel to the DVD RW on
    the Secondary channel. You would NOT try to copy a disk from the Primary
    slave to the Primary master as there would definitely be bandwidth
    contention since they're sharing the same channel.

    If you're using Ultra-ATA cables as I described earlier then you would need
    to put the drives in a specific order in the front bays. Typically you
    would put the Primary master in the top slot (black connector), the Primary
    slave immediately underneath (grey connector), and the Secondary master
    immediately underneath that (black connector). If you try other
    arrangements you may not have enough slack in the ribbon cables to connect
    the devices.

    Remember to check in Device Manager that your EIDE controllers are using DMA
    and not PIO as the transfer mode.
    DRS, Apr 27, 2006
  9. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    Is that a general limitation or a motherboard one? I ask since EIDE
    supports ATAPI and CD/DVDs are ATAPI devices. Mind you, it's been a long
    time since I've even had to think about EIDE.
    DRS, Apr 27, 2006
  10. Jackpine

    Jackpine Guest

    It sounds like you have an older motherboard. EIDE stands fo
    Enhanced IDE.
    My motherboard was manufactured May 2005. I don't know it tha
    qualifies it as being "old."
    In any event, I have decided to install only the DVD-RW and DVD/CD-R
    drives, and it appears that they are connected to the mobo at th
    PRI_IDE port

    However, this business of IDE versus EIDE connectors is confusing t
    me. I have read the posts in this thread, Googled the topic, an
    reread my mobo manual. Here is a direct quote from it: "ID
    Connectors (40-1 pin PRI_EIDE [red], SEC_EIDE [red]. Thes
    connectors are for Ultra ATA 133/100/66 signal cables. The ITE ID
    connectors support up to four IDE hard disk drives for easier dat
    storage. (The connectors do not support ATAPI devices.)

    So... How do I rationalize what the manual says with what DRS says
    The bottom line is that I still don't know what can be installed o
    the PRI_EIDE and SEC_EIDE ports
    Jackpine, Apr 28, 2006
  11. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    Unless you actually tell us what it is we have to guess, and any board which
    has a genuine old-fashioned 40-pin IDE port sounds old to me. My 5 year old
    ASUS motherboard on which I ran my PIII until recently didn't have a 40-pin
    IDE connector, it had 2 x Ultra-ATA 66.
    That's bizarre. Genuine EIDE doesn't support the Ultra-ATA speeds and
    Ultra-ATA most certainly supports CD/DVD drives. What's more, the Ultra-ATA
    cables are 80-pin, although they'll connect to a 40-pin socket, but why
    they'd specify that is beyond me. I might have to bow out at this point.
    DRS, Apr 28, 2006
  12. Jackpine

    Jackpine Guest

    Unless you actually tell us what it is we have to guess, and an
    board which
    Sorry, my motherboard is an ASUS P5LD2 Deluxe, if that is any help
    Jackpine, Apr 29, 2006
  13. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    It matters. According to the manual (p. 2-26) the two red "EIDE" connectors
    are for RAID and *that's* why it says they're for hard disks only. It even
    says they don't support ATAPI devices (99% of CD/DVD drives are ATAPI), even
    though the genuine (but outdated) EDIE standard does support ATAPI. I don't
    know why ASUS would label them as "EDIE" because they're not, they're
    actually Ultra-ATA 133/100/66 connectors but in this case connected to the
    RAID controller.

    The blue "IDE" connector (p. 2-25) is in fact an Ultra-ATA (aka Ultra-DMA)
    100/66 port, so use the ribbon cable with the blue, grey and black
    connectors that came with the motherboard for your CD/DVD drives, not the
    one with the three black connectors. But one IDE channel equals a maximum
    of two IDE devices, so that's settled at last. If you want more you will
    have to buy a PCI IDE card.

    BTW, is there a way you can configure your newsreader to format posts
    properly? It's not using the message-ids properly so your posts are not
    nested under the post to which you are referring (which makes the thread
    harder to follow), and it's not quoting the posting-id and message-id of the
    posts you quote.
    DRS, Apr 30, 2006
  14. Jackpine

    Maus Guest

    "The blue "IDE" connector (p. 2-25) is in fact an Ultra-ATA (aka Ultra-DMA)
    100/66 port, so use the ribbon cable with the blue, grey and black
    connectors that came with the motherboard for your CD/DVD drives, not the
    one with the three black connectors. But one IDE channel equals a maximum
    of two IDE devices, so that's settled at last."

    i've 1 dvd-rom and a burner on my A8N-SLI deluxe connected with the 'three
    black connectors"-cable (labeled cd-rom) in the black (second?) slot. So it
    will be wise to connect them with the "blue, grey and black " cable in the
    bleu (first?) slot?

    Or one with the "blue, grey and black " cable and the other with the 'three
    black connectors"-cable ? and then both set to master?

    So what are the 'official' anmes of teh cables again? ;-)

    Maus, May 2, 2006
  15. Jackpine

    FeMaster Guest

    He actually did, it's in the subject line, and is in fact, a very new mobo.
    I was going to write the same thing as you, until I noticed the mobo in the
    subject, and looked it up. I'm not at all sure what the deal is with Asus
    naming the sockets as they do, but what he wrote below this is in fact
    exactly out of the manual... Maybe they are just "updating" the terms to
    modern standards? Who knows...
    FeMaster, May 2, 2006
  16. Jackpine

    FeMaster Guest

    If both cables are 80-conductor, and you use the Master/Slave settings, as
    opposed to the Cable Select, it won't make a difference which one you use
    where. The colors are more to help keep things straight when a person is
    looking at the inside and connections, more that anything... Both cables
    are probably identical, aside from the colored connectors.

    It's possible that the all black cable doesn't have the proper pin
    disconnected to use in a Cable Select setup, but then again, I'm not
    familiar with RAID HD setups, so I don't know if they fall under the same
    category as needing to be decided if one is Master and one is Slave, or if
    they don't need to be distinguished as such...
    FeMaster, May 2, 2006
  17. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    My bad. I have a bit of a habit of not paying much attention to subject
    lines anymore since they're so often so vague or even misleading. :)
    DRS, May 3, 2006
  18. Jackpine

    DRS Guest

    The ribbon cables with three black connectors are 40-conductor, the ones
    with the blue, grey and black connectors are 80-conductor. All the extra 40
    wires are ground wires interleaved with the others. Their purpose is to
    reduce cross-talk, thus enabling the higher data transfer rates for
    Ultra-ATA 66 and higher (modes 4, 5, 6) to work reliably. CD/DVD drives
    typically use mode 2 (Ultra-ATA 33), so it is possible to get away with
    using a 40-conductor cable, but personally I wouldn't trust it, especially
    if it's anywhere near the 46cm (18") limit. As far as I'm concerned
    40-conductor cables are fit only for the bin.

    Cable Select is also handled differently by 40-conductor and 80-conductor
    cables. With a 40-conductor cable that supports CSEL (older ones do not),
    the master goes on the middle connector and the slave on the end. That is
    because on those cables the Pin 28 wire is simply cut between the two device
    connectors, and the master needs the Pin 28 contact.

    With an 80-conductor cable it's reversed, with the master on the end (black
    connector) and the slave on the middle (grey connector). The grey connector
    lacks the pin 28 contact.
    DRS, May 3, 2006
  19. Jackpine

    FeMaster Guest

    I hear you there!
    FeMaster, May 3, 2006
  20. Jackpine

    FeMaster Guest

    That's what I do; I don't even bother with 40-conductors. Why would you,
    80's are so easy to come by...
    Learn something new every day... Almost doesn't make sense for the
    80-conductor cable. I would think it would be easier to just snip the wire
    leading to the end connector, as opposed to bypassing the middle
    connector... How does that work, do they just not have a pin in the middle
    connector, so that no contact is made?
    FeMaster, May 3, 2006
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