Can't Eject a Volume

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Nick Naym, Feb 18, 2014.

  1. Nick Naym

    Nick Naym Guest

    I have a 2TB WD "My Book Essential" (read that as "cheap piece of crap")
    external drive on which I created two 1TB partitions. Initially, I used
    one simply as a place to store selected (drag & dropped) folders from my
    internal drive; the other for a SuperDuper clone. I got the thing a
    couple of years ago when my previous iMac's HD was failing, simply to
    have an additional (to my TM and clone backups on two external LaCie d2
    Quadras) backup.

    Recently, I erased the one that contained the dragged & dropped folders
    and used it to create a second SuperDuper clone.

    When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.

    Any ideas?



    --
    iMac (27", 3.2 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 1 TB HDD) • OS X (10.8.5)
     
    Nick Naym, Feb 18, 2014
    #1
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  2. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article
    <1lh9o11.jdr30za7497aN%nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid>, Nick
    Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:

    > When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    > turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    > appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    > virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    > containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    > alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    > programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    > Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    > by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.


    one or more files is still open.

    you can use the command line utility lsof to find out what file that is.

    it also could just be yet another finder bug.
     
    nospam, Feb 18, 2014
    #2
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  3. Nick Naym

    Guest

    Nick Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> writes:

    > virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    > containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    > alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    > programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    > Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    > by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.


    After the failed attempt to eject it, launch the Terminal program and
    try this command -

    lsof | grep Volumes

    and see what shows up. lsof = list open files...

    Billy Y..
    --
    sub #'9+1 ,r0 ; convert ascii byte
    add #9.+1 ,r0 ; to an integer
    bcc 20$ ; not a number
     
    , Feb 18, 2014
    #3
    Alt likes this.
  4. Nick Naym

    Alan Ralph Guest

    On 18/02/2014 19:32, Nick Naym wrote:
    > When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    > turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    > appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    > virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    > containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    > alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    > programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    > Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    > by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.
    >
    > Any ideas?


    It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.

    Alan.
     
    Alan Ralph, Feb 18, 2014
    #4
  5. Nick Naym

    M-M Guest

    In article
    <1lh9o11.jdr30za7497aN%nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid>, Nick
    Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:

    > I have a 2TB WD "My Book Essential" (read that as "cheap piece of crap")
    > external drive on which I created two 1TB partitions. Initially, I used
    > one simply as a place to store selected (drag & dropped) folders from my
    > internal drive; the other for a SuperDuper clone. I got the thing a
    > couple of years ago when my previous iMac's HD was failing, simply to
    > have an additional (to my TM and clone backups on two external LaCie d2
    > Quadras) backup.
    >
    > Recently, I erased the one that contained the dragged & dropped folders
    > and used it to create a second SuperDuper clone.
    >
    > When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    > turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    > appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    > virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    > containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    > alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    > programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    > Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    > by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.
    >
    > Any ideas?


    The problem is likely because Spotlight is busy indexing the disk. Go
    to Spotlight's Privacy settings and exclude that disk.
     
    M-M, Feb 19, 2014
    #5
  6. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > > The problem is likely because Spotlight is busy indexing the disk. Go
    > > to Spotlight's Privacy settings and exclude that disk.

    >
    > Save yourself some mystery and potential time, and don't bother doing
    > this until you use the lsof command to see what's using it. It's best to
    > know what the problem is *before* you try to fix it. ; )


    it's very likely it's spotlight and if turning it off fixes it, then
    that's what the problem was. plus, spotlight should be off for a
    superduper clone anyway.
     
    nospam, Feb 19, 2014
    #6
  7. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > >> > The problem is likely because Spotlight is busy indexing the disk. Go
    > >> > to Spotlight's Privacy settings and exclude that disk.
    > >>
    > >> Save yourself some mystery and potential time, and don't bother doing
    > >> this until you use the lsof command to see what's using it. It's best to
    > >> know what the problem is *before* you try to fix it. ; )

    > >
    > > it's very likely it's spotlight and if turning it off fixes it, then
    > > that's what the problem was. plus, spotlight should be off for a
    > > superduper clone anyway.

    >
    > LOL! You really are a **** tard. You yourself suggested running lsof in
    > a reply in this very thread.


    yes i did, but i also didn't think about spotlight, which is almost
    certainly the cause.

    > The only reason you're popping your head
    > out of your ass now is to start yet another pointless argument because
    > you have a hard stick up your ass for me since I call you out on your
    > stupid weasel games time and again.


    don't flatter yourself. i don't give a flying **** what you do.

    my reason for posting was to help the original poster, but then you
    decided to turn this into a flame fest and demonstrate just how much of
    utter an asshole you can be.

    it's a lot easier to turn off spotlight and see if it fixes the problem
    rather than wade through the output of lsof, but if that doesn't solve
    the problem, then use lsof.
     
    nospam, Feb 19, 2014
    #7
  8. Nick Naym

    Lewis Guest

    In message <1lh9o11.jdr30za7497aN%nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid>
    Nick Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:
    > When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    > turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    > appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    > virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    > containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    > alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    > programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    > Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    > by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.


    When this happens, open up Terminal.app

    lsof /Volumes/Drivename

    --
    oh no! there's been unauthorized access to my paypal account!!! ... how
    nice of someone at a grade school in korea to notice and inform me of it
     
    Lewis, Feb 20, 2014
    #8
  9. Nick Naym

    Lewis Guest

    In message <le0f64$i8t$>
    Alan Ralph <> wrote:
    > On 18/02/2014 19:32, Nick Naym wrote:
    >> When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    >> turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    >> appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    >> virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    >> containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    >> alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    >> programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    >> Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    >> by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.
    >>
    >> Any ideas?


    > It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    > 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    > wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    > for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.


    Don't do this.

    --
    A ship should not ride on a single anchor, nor life on a single hope
     
    Lewis, Feb 20, 2014
    #9
  10. Nick Naym

    Alan Ralph Guest

    On 20/02/2014 15:13, Lewis wrote:
    > In message <le0f64$i8t$>
    > Alan Ralph <> wrote:
    >> On 18/02/2014 19:32, Nick Naym wrote:
    >>> When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    >>> turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    >>> appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    >>> virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    >>> containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    >>> alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    >>> programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    >>> Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    >>> by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.
    >>>
    >>> Any ideas?

    >
    >> It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    >> 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    >> wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    >> for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.

    >
    > Don't do this.


    Care to expand on why you think it's the wrong course of action?

    Alan
     
    Alan Ralph, Feb 20, 2014
    #10
  11. Nick Naym

    Lewis Guest

    In message <le5qqs$n2q$>
    Alan Ralph <> wrote:
    > On 20/02/2014 15:13, Lewis wrote:
    >> In message <le0f64$i8t$>
    >> Alan Ralph <> wrote:
    >>> On 18/02/2014 19:32, Nick Naym wrote:
    >>>> When I plug the drive in (that's right, there's no on/off switch...you
    >>>> turn it on/off by plugging/un[plugging it into the AC), both volumes
    >>>> appear on the desktop, and both can be accessed. Oddly, however,
    >>>> virtually any time I attempt to unmount/eject the volumes, the one
    >>>> containing the second SuperDuper clone refuses to eject: I receive the
    >>>> alert "The disk [name of volume] wasn't ejected because one or more
    >>>> programs may be using it." Besides Finder, nothing is running, and Disk
    >>>> Utility can't find any problems.The only way I can unmount/eject it is
    >>>> by force-ejection or by shutting down my iMac and unplugging the drive.
    >>>>
    >>>> Any ideas?

    >>
    >>> It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    >>> 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    >>> wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    >>> for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.

    >>
    >> Don't do this.


    > Care to expand on why you think it's the wrong course of action?


    Force quitting apps is generally to be avoided. Force quitting an app
    like the Finder where you are never sure of the state it is in is
    absolutely to be avoided.

    --
    I have a love child who sends me hate mail
     
    Lewis, Feb 21, 2014
    #11
  12. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > >>> It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    > >>> 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    > >>> wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    > >>> for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.
    > >>
    > >> Don't do this.

    > >
    > > Care to expand on why you think it's the wrong course of action?

    >
    > Personally, I tend to prefer actually knowing what the problem is
    > *before* I try to fix it. There's a chance Finder has a file open, but


    the problem is finder often keeps files open long after they've been
    closed. it's yet another finder bug. it's not something anyone is going
    to fix either.
     
    nospam, Feb 21, 2014
    #12
  13. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Lewis
    <> wrote:

    > Force quitting apps is generally to be avoided. Force quitting an app
    > like the Finder where you are never sure of the state it is in is
    > absolutely to be avoided.


    finder isn't always sure what state it's in, so how can anyone else be?

    it doesn't properly close files all the time, which means force-quit is
    the only option (other than logging out or rebooting which is a much
    bigger hassle).
     
    nospam, Feb 21, 2014
    #13
  14. Nick Naym

    Tim Streater Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > On 2014-02-21, Lewis <> wrote:
    > > In message <le5qqs$n2q$> Alan Ralph
    > > <> wrote:
    > >> On 20/02/2014 15:13, Lewis wrote:
    > >>> In message <le0f64$i8t$> Alan Ralph
    > >>> <> wrote:
    > >>>>
    > >>>> It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    > >>>> 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    > >>>> wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    > >>>> for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.
    > >>>
    > >>> Don't do this.

    > >
    > >> Care to expand on why you think it's the wrong course of action?

    > >
    > > Force quitting apps is generally to be avoided.

    >
    > To expand on this, force quitting an application can cause any file that
    > the application currently has open to become corrupt, since it does not
    > give the application a chance to finish updating the file in question
    > and close it before quitting. Applications may have their own preference
    > files open, or other files on your startup volume. If an application's
    > preference file becomes malformed or corrupt, it can cause the
    > application in question to behave in unpredictable ways on subsequent
    > launches.


    The files will all be closed when the app quits. You *might* leave an
    important file in a dicky state, but not necessarily. I force-quit Word
    2008 quit often, but it starts up just fine every time.

    > > Force quitting an app like the Finder where you are never sure of the
    > > state it is in is absolutely to be avoided.

    >
    > I'm not sure I would consider Finder to be that fragile - certainly not
    > as fragile as other applications or system processes. If there is a file
    > copy in progress, you certainly ant to avoid force quitting it, and as
    > stated above, there is always the possibility that you can cause Finder
    > preference files to become corrupt if you force quit it. But in general,
    > if your system is relatively idle, you can often force quit the Finder
    > without too much concern.


    Well quite. And if that's still a concern, get hold of one of the many
    apps that will add a Quit item to Finder.

    In fact looking at the Force-Quit window, if you choose Finder the
    button changes to say "Relaunch", so that would seem safe enough.

    --
    "People don't buy Microsoft for quality, they buy it for compatibility
    with what Bob in accounting bought last year. Trace it back - they buy
    Microsoft because the IBM Selectric didn't suck much" - P Seebach, afc
     
    Tim Streater, Feb 21, 2014
    #14
  15. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > On 2014-02-21, nospam <> wrote:
    > > In article <>, Jolly Roger
    > ><> wrote:
    > >
    > >> >>> It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    > >> >>> 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    > >> >>> wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    > >> >>> for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.
    > >> >>
    > >> >> Don't do this.
    > >> >
    > >> > Care to expand on why you think it's the wrong course of action?
    > >>
    > >> Personally, I tend to prefer actually knowing what the problem is
    > >> *before* I try to fix it. There's a chance Finder has a file open, but

    > >
    > > the problem is finder often keeps files open long after they've been
    > > closed. it's yet another finder bug. it's not something anyone is going
    > > to fix either.

    >
    > There is no evidence so far that the OP's Finder application has a file
    > open. If another application is at fault, force quitting the Finder will
    > do absolutely nothing to fix the problem.


    obviously. nobody said otherwise.

    > Better to do a simple "lsof
    > /Volumes/volume-name" query to find out exactly which application has
    > exactly which files open. Once you know what the actual cause is, you
    > can tailor a fix to the actual problem rather than stabbing in the dark
    > and crossing your fingers you get lucky.


    as has been said, the reason the disk won't eject is likely due to
    spotlight, so turning off spotlight for that drive will probably
    resolve the issue. it's very easy to do and entirely harmless and
    should be the first thing to try.

    if that doesn't solve the problem, then the problem is elsewhere, at
    which point, someone can dig deeper to find out what's going on.

    in other words, start with the simple stuff first. not only is this a
    common troubleshooting technique, but it's done in just about every
    industry. too bad you don't understand that.
     
    nospam, Feb 21, 2014
    #15
  16. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > To expand on this, force quitting an application can cause any file that
    > the application currently has open to become corrupt, since it does not
    > give the application a chance to finish updating the file in question
    > and close it before quitting. Applications may have their own preference
    > files open, or other files on your startup volume. If an application's
    > preference file becomes malformed or corrupt, it can cause the
    > application in question to behave in unpredictable ways on subsequent
    > launches.


    that's possible, but very unlikely because files are written atomically.

    you might lose changes you made since the last save, but that's about
    it. it's extremely unlikely that anything will be corrupted.

    however, nothing is perfect and there is a very tiny chance something
    could go wrong. files can get corrupted even without force-quitting.
    shit happens.

    > > Force quitting an app like the Finder where you are never sure of the
    > > state it is in is absolutely to be avoided.

    >
    > I'm not sure I would consider Finder to be that fragile - certainly not
    > as fragile as other applications or system processes.


    nonsense. finder is one of the buggiest parts of os x and apple has
    shown no interest in fixing it.

    some of its bugs have been there for years, as far back as os x 10.0.
    it still gets file/folder sizes wrong and does not properly handle time
    zones. apparently, nobody at apple ever leaves cupertino. if someone
    cancels emptying trash, it will usually get stuck canceling, and the
    only way to fix that is force-quit. the list goes on.
     
    nospam, Feb 21, 2014
    #16
  17. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <210220141710070112%>, Tim Streater
    <> wrote:

    > In fact looking at the Force-Quit window, if you choose Finder the
    > button changes to say "Relaunch", so that would seem safe enough.


    yep.
     
    nospam, Feb 21, 2014
    #17
  18. Nick Naym

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Jolly Roger
    <> wrote:

    > >> To expand on this, force quitting an application can cause any file that
    > >> the application currently has open to become corrupt, since it does not
    > >> give the application a chance to finish updating the file in question
    > >> and close it before quitting. Applications may have their own preference
    > >> files open, or other files on your startup volume. If an application's
    > >> preference file becomes malformed or corrupt, it can cause the
    > >> application in question to behave in unpredictable ways on subsequent
    > >> launches.

    > >
    > > that's possible, but very unlikely because files are written atomically.

    >
    > mr.know-it-all won't be able to provide evidence that all (or even most)
    > files are written atomically by all applications. The fact is that
    > application developers may choose keep files open for relatively long
    > periods of time, and whether an application has a file open, or has
    > completed writing to that file, at any point in time cannot be predicted
    > ahead of time.


    developers could do a lot of things. that doesn't mean they do.

    the vast majority of developers are not stupid and write files
    atomically because they know that's the safest way to do it.

    not only that, but just because a file is open when an app is
    force-quit does mean it will be corrupted. a force-quit is typically
    done *after* an app has crashed, so the damage, if any, has already
    happened.

    if this was a huge problem, we'd be hearing about data loss when people
    force-quit apps, and we don't, therefore it's not a serious issue.

    real world experience is what matters.

    > Now I predict mr.know-it-all will try to move the goal posts, which is
    > typical of his silly tit-for-tat arguments...


    i'm not the one who is moving the goalposts.

    > >> > Force quitting an app like the Finder where you are never sure of the
    > >> > state it is in is absolutely to be avoided.
    > >>
    > >> I'm not sure I would consider Finder to be that fragile - certainly not
    > >> as fragile as other applications or system processes.

    > >
    > > nonsense. finder is one of the buggiest parts of os x and apple has
    > > shown no interest in fixing it.

    >
    > Now he's trying to move the goal posts yet again. He ignores that we are
    > talking specifically about files open by the Finder. Now he's trying to
    > change the topic to general Finder bugs. Lame. That's not what we are
    > discussing here. Nice try, but no cigar, mr.know-it-all.


    actually it is what is being discussed.

    or have you already forgotten that *you* said finder was not fragile?

    typical for you, when facts are shoved in your face, you get all bent
    out of shape.
     
    nospam, Feb 21, 2014
    #18
  19. Nick Naym

    Lewis Guest

    In message <>
    Jolly Roger <> wrote:
    > On 2014-02-21, nospam <> wrote:
    >> In article <>, Jolly Roger
    >><> wrote:
    >>
    >>> >>> It may well be Finder itself still accessing the external disk. Select
    >>> >>> 'Force Quit' from the Apple menu, select Finder, click 'Relaunch', then
    >>> >>> wait while Finder restarts and refreshes the desktop. This also works
    >>> >>> for CDs or DVDs that refuse to eject.
    >>> >>
    >>> >> Don't do this.
    >>> >
    >>> > Care to expand on why you think it's the wrong course of action?
    >>>
    >>> Personally, I tend to prefer actually knowing what the problem is
    >>> *before* I try to fix it. There's a chance Finder has a file open, but

    >>
    >> the problem is finder often keeps files open long after they've been
    >> closed. it's yet another finder bug. it's not something anyone is going
    >> to fix either.


    > There is no evidence so far that the OP's Finder application has a file
    > open. If another application is at fault, force quitting the Finder will
    > do absolutely nothing to fix the problem. Better to do a simple "lsof
    > /Volumes/volume-name" query to find out exactly which application has


    lsof /Volumes

    Works pretty well unless you have a lot of drives mounted.

    > exactly which files open. Once you know what the actual cause is, you
    > can tailor a fix to the actual problem rather than stabbing in the dark
    > and crossing your fingers you get lucky.


    Of course, when you try to eject a volume and it cannot be ejected
    because a file is open, the dialog will tell you which application has
    the file open in most cases if there is only one application involved.

    The Volume "Tardis" cannot be ejected because it is being used by
    "Terminal".

    Or something like that.

    > I have no doubt you will try to argue that stabbing in the dark and
    > guessing is somehow better than actually knowing the cause of the
    > problem, because in your world you are *always* right and *never* wrong,
    > and the center of the all-knowing universe. So go ahead and make
    > yourself look like a fool, further earning your nickname
    > "mr.know-it-all" if you wish.


    I would recommend

    hdiutil eject -force /Volumes/name

    as a better choice than force-quitting the finder anyway.

    --
    All tribal myths are true, for a given value of 'true'.
     
    Lewis, Feb 21, 2014
    #19
  20. Nick Naym

    Alan Browne Guest

    On 2014.02.21, 13:07 , nospam wrote:
    > In article <>, Jolly Roger
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >> To expand on this, force quitting an application can cause any file that
    >> the application currently has open to become corrupt, since it does not
    >> give the application a chance to finish updating the file in question
    >> and close it before quitting. Applications may have their own preference
    >> files open, or other files on your startup volume. If an application's
    >> preference file becomes malformed or corrupt, it can cause the
    >> application in question to behave in unpredictable ways on subsequent
    >> launches.

    >
    > that's possible, but very unlikely because files are written atomically.
    >
    > you might lose changes you made since the last save, but that's about
    > it. it's extremely unlikely that anything will be corrupted.


    I have to agree with J-R although we don't usually agree on very much.

    Apps only do as the programmer programmed. I've written apps where
    files remain open for weeks - that includes random access read/writeable
    files (simple flat databases, if you will). Certainly data recorders
    with files open for hours or even days at a time. No ill came from it
    (DOS, Windows).

    Log files can be left open or closed then appended to - but in large
    projects it's quite common to have many files open for write at a given
    time. Makes it easy to simply keep all the closures for the cleanup
    code when the program exits.

    Some files (Maintenance of config files for example) owned by an
    application are usually written and closed in one go. That's appropriate.

    OS X is also a collection of "middleware apps". lsof-ing the system
    disk shows a large number of files opened at any given time. (As well
    as by whatever apps happen to be running).

    --
    Those who have reduced our privacy, whether they are state
    or commercial actors, prefer that we do not reduce theirs.
    - Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
     
    Alan Browne, Feb 21, 2014
    #20
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