Does Cool'n'quiet control K8n Neo2 chipset fan?

Discussion in 'MSI' started by Beemer, Apr 19, 2007.

  1. Beemer

    Beemer Guest

    My nvidea chipset fan appears to be running at full speed although
    Cool'n'quiet is working for the CPU speed and CPU fan control. Should the
    chipset fan be controlled on my MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum?

    Beemer
     
    Beemer, Apr 19, 2007
    #1
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  2. Beemer

    Paul Guest

    Cool N' Quiet adjusts FID and VID (multiplier and voltage value)
    as a function of measured system load. If the system is "idle",
    then CNQ uses the minimum multiplier and Vcore voltage. If the
    load on the system is 100%, then the FID is adjusted to the maximum.
    Adjustments are made on frequent intervals (like perhaps every time
    the task scheduler runs).

    Fan control is completely separate from CNQ. A fan may have its own
    built-in control method (like the thermistor in an Intel fan that
    makes the Intel CPU fan sensitive to computer air temperature). A
    fan can run at a constant speed (because no control method is
    enabled, or because there is no power transistor next to the fan
    header, to adjust the voltage).

    The Super I/O chip has temperature measurement channels. It also
    has automatic or manual fan speed control options. BIOS code or
    an application, can access the registers on the Super I/O, and do
    some form of temperature based control. But if the fan headers
    don't have a power transistor, to turn the Super I/O fan control
    signal into something the fan can use, then the fan will be stuck
    running at 100% speed. Many motherboard makers won't spend the extra
    money to put a power transistor on each and every fan header. Some
    premium boards only have two controlled channels.

    An example of a program for controlling the fans, is SpeedFan from
    almico.com . But SpeedFan can only work, if the power transistor is
    present on the fan header. SpeedFan can pretend to adjust all the
    fan control channels it sees in a Super I/O chip, but without the
    necessary power transistor, the adjustment would be for nothing.

    The chipset should have a more constant thermal load, than other
    parts of the system. So there might be less reason for a control
    system, to be adjusting the speed. The heat dissipated on the Northbridge,
    would be proportional to the number of interfaces that are enabled on
    the chip. For example, chipsets that have dual channel memory, run
    cooler if only one channel is operating. It is possible to disable
    the other channel, if it is known, by probing the SMBUS, that no DIMMs
    are present, and the clocks and interface busses can be disabled
    as a result. Similarly, a Northbridge may have 21 PCI Express lanes
    terminating on it, and the more lanes that can be disabled, the
    cooler the Northbridge would run. Some chipsets are now at the
    20W level, meaning a fan is an excellent idea, if the heatsink
    used is a cheap one. Without a fan, in a case like that, the chip
    is going to boil. Even motherboards with exotic passive cooling
    methods, still rely on "spill air" from the CPU cooler, to help
    with the cooling. That is why some motherboards include auxiliary
    clip-on fans, for users who make extensive use of water blocks and
    water cooling.

    Northbridges are also affected by overclocking. Some Northbridges
    seem to track the multiplier being used on the processor, and the
    internal Northbridge clock is influenced by the overclocking choices
    being made. Some motherboards also allow changing the voltages used
    on the Northbridge and Southbridge, which again could make a difference
    to how much cooling was required.

    Chances are, if you remove the fan from your Northbridge, the chip
    may end up running too hot. If you want to replace it, try something
    like one of these. These still benefit from spill air from the
    CPU or other fan. Convection may not be enough.

    ( Thermalright HR-05 series )
    http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05.htm
    http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05sli.htm

    Paul
     
    Paul, Apr 19, 2007
    #2
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  3. Beemer

    Beemer Guest

    | Beemer wrote:
    | > My nvidea chipset fan appears to be running at full speed although
    | > Cool'n'quiet is working for the CPU speed and CPU fan control. Should
    the
    | > chipset fan be controlled on my MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum?
    | >
    | > Beemer
    |
    | Cool N' Quiet adjusts FID and VID (multiplier and voltage value)
    | as a function of measured system load. If the system is "idle",
    | then CNQ uses the minimum multiplier and Vcore voltage. If the
    | load on the system is 100%, then the FID is adjusted to the maximum.
    | Adjustments are made on frequent intervals (like perhaps every time
    | the task scheduler runs).
    |
    | Fan control is completely separate from CNQ. A fan may have its own
    | built-in control method (like the thermistor in an Intel fan that
    | makes the Intel CPU fan sensitive to computer air temperature). A
    | fan can run at a constant speed (because no control method is
    | enabled, or because there is no power transistor next to the fan
    | header, to adjust the voltage).
    |
    | The Super I/O chip has temperature measurement channels. It also
    | has automatic or manual fan speed control options. BIOS code or
    | an application, can access the registers on the Super I/O, and do
    | some form of temperature based control. But if the fan headers
    | don't have a power transistor, to turn the Super I/O fan control
    | signal into something the fan can use, then the fan will be stuck
    | running at 100% speed. Many motherboard makers won't spend the extra
    | money to put a power transistor on each and every fan header. Some
    | premium boards only have two controlled channels.
    |
    | An example of a program for controlling the fans, is SpeedFan from
    | almico.com . But SpeedFan can only work, if the power transistor is
    | present on the fan header. SpeedFan can pretend to adjust all the
    | fan control channels it sees in a Super I/O chip, but without the
    | necessary power transistor, the adjustment would be for nothing.
    |
    | The chipset should have a more constant thermal load, than other
    | parts of the system. So there might be less reason for a control
    | system, to be adjusting the speed. The heat dissipated on the Northbridge,
    | would be proportional to the number of interfaces that are enabled on
    | the chip. For example, chipsets that have dual channel memory, run
    | cooler if only one channel is operating. It is possible to disable
    | the other channel, if it is known, by probing the SMBUS, that no DIMMs
    | are present, and the clocks and interface busses can be disabled
    | as a result. Similarly, a Northbridge may have 21 PCI Express lanes
    | terminating on it, and the more lanes that can be disabled, the
    | cooler the Northbridge would run. Some chipsets are now at the
    | 20W level, meaning a fan is an excellent idea, if the heatsink
    | used is a cheap one. Without a fan, in a case like that, the chip
    | is going to boil. Even motherboards with exotic passive cooling
    | methods, still rely on "spill air" from the CPU cooler, to help
    | with the cooling. That is why some motherboards include auxiliary
    | clip-on fans, for users who make extensive use of water blocks and
    | water cooling.
    |
    | Northbridges are also affected by overclocking. Some Northbridges
    | seem to track the multiplier being used on the processor, and the
    | internal Northbridge clock is influenced by the overclocking choices
    | being made. Some motherboards also allow changing the voltages used
    | on the Northbridge and Southbridge, which again could make a difference
    | to how much cooling was required.
    |
    | Chances are, if you remove the fan from your Northbridge, the chip
    | may end up running too hot. If you want to replace it, try something
    | like one of these. These still benefit from spill air from the
    | CPU or other fan. Convection may not be enough.
    |
    | ( Thermalright HR-05 series )
    | http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05.htm
    | http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05sli.htm
    |
    | Paul

    Paul,

    Thanks for the compehensive reply. I was not aware that the fan control was
    separate from cnq. I have the Nvidia Nforce2 chip which I believe is a
    combined Northbridge and Southbridge. I may put a simpler heatsink on it
    with a larger and slower fan. I have the same high speed noise problem on
    my graphics board. Its makes me smile when I see products advertised as
    "low noise" yet they have high speed fan with ball bearings instead of slow
    speed with sleeve bearings.

    thanks,

    Beemer
     
    Beemer, Apr 19, 2007
    #3
  4. Beemer

    AdvarP Guest

    I have removed the small cr*ppy noisy fan on my k8N SLI with a Zalman
    passive heatsink. The noise was too much to bear - on a $250 Mobo. Works Ok
    for 2 years now. I suggest you do the same. Watch out for the heatsink
    touching ANYTHING else...
     
    AdvarP, Apr 24, 2007
    #4
  5. Beemer

    Beemer Guest

    |I have removed the small cr*ppy noisy fan on my k8N SLI with a Zalman
    | passive heatsink. The noise was too much to bear - on a $250 Mobo. Works
    Ok
    | for 2 years now. I suggest you do the same. Watch out for the heatsink
    | touching ANYTHING else...
    |
    |
    | | >
    | > | Beemer wrote:
    | > | > My nvidea chipset fan appears to be running at full speed although
    | > | > Cool'n'quiet is working for the CPU speed and CPU fan control.
    Should
    | > the
    | > | > chipset fan be controlled on my MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum?
    | > | >
    | > | > Beemer
    | > |
    | > | Cool N' Quiet adjusts FID and VID (multiplier and voltage value)
    | > | as a function of measured system load. If the system is "idle",
    | > | then CNQ uses the minimum multiplier and Vcore voltage. If the
    | > | load on the system is 100%, then the FID is adjusted to the maximum.
    | > | Adjustments are made on frequent intervals (like perhaps every time
    | > | the task scheduler runs).
    | > |
    | > | Fan control is completely separate from CNQ. A fan may have its own
    | > | built-in control method (like the thermistor in an Intel fan that
    | > | makes the Intel CPU fan sensitive to computer air temperature). A
    | > | fan can run at a constant speed (because no control method is
    | > | enabled, or because there is no power transistor next to the fan
    | > | header, to adjust the voltage).
    | > |
    | > | The Super I/O chip has temperature measurement channels. It also
    | > | has automatic or manual fan speed control options. BIOS code or
    | > | an application, can access the registers on the Super I/O, and do
    | > | some form of temperature based control. But if the fan headers
    | > | don't have a power transistor, to turn the Super I/O fan control
    | > | signal into something the fan can use, then the fan will be stuck
    | > | running at 100% speed. Many motherboard makers won't spend the extra
    | > | money to put a power transistor on each and every fan header. Some
    | > | premium boards only have two controlled channels.
    | > |
    | > | An example of a program for controlling the fans, is SpeedFan from
    | > | almico.com . But SpeedFan can only work, if the power transistor is
    | > | present on the fan header. SpeedFan can pretend to adjust all the
    | > | fan control channels it sees in a Super I/O chip, but without the
    | > | necessary power transistor, the adjustment would be for nothing.
    | > |
    | > | The chipset should have a more constant thermal load, than other
    | > | parts of the system. So there might be less reason for a control
    | > | system, to be adjusting the speed. The heat dissipated on the
    | > Northbridge,
    | > | would be proportional to the number of interfaces that are enabled on
    | > | the chip. For example, chipsets that have dual channel memory, run
    | > | cooler if only one channel is operating. It is possible to disable
    | > | the other channel, if it is known, by probing the SMBUS, that no DIMMs
    | > | are present, and the clocks and interface busses can be disabled
    | > | as a result. Similarly, a Northbridge may have 21 PCI Express lanes
    | > | terminating on it, and the more lanes that can be disabled, the
    | > | cooler the Northbridge would run. Some chipsets are now at the
    | > | 20W level, meaning a fan is an excellent idea, if the heatsink
    | > | used is a cheap one. Without a fan, in a case like that, the chip
    | > | is going to boil. Even motherboards with exotic passive cooling
    | > | methods, still rely on "spill air" from the CPU cooler, to help
    | > | with the cooling. That is why some motherboards include auxiliary
    | > | clip-on fans, for users who make extensive use of water blocks and
    | > | water cooling.
    | > |
    | > | Northbridges are also affected by overclocking. Some Northbridges
    | > | seem to track the multiplier being used on the processor, and the
    | > | internal Northbridge clock is influenced by the overclocking choices
    | > | being made. Some motherboards also allow changing the voltages used
    | > | on the Northbridge and Southbridge, which again could make a
    difference
    | > | to how much cooling was required.
    | > |
    | > | Chances are, if you remove the fan from your Northbridge, the chip
    | > | may end up running too hot. If you want to replace it, try something
    | > | like one of these. These still benefit from spill air from the
    | > | CPU or other fan. Convection may not be enough.
    | > |
    | > | ( Thermalright HR-05 series )
    | > | http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05.htm
    | > | http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05sli.htm
    | > |
    | > | Paul
    | >
    | > Paul,
    | >
    | > Thanks for the compehensive reply. I was not aware that the fan control
    | > was
    | > separate from cnq. I have the Nvidia Nforce2 chip which I believe is a
    | > combined Northbridge and Southbridge. I may put a simpler heatsink on
    it
    | > with a larger and slower fan. I have the same high speed noise problem
    | > on
    | > my graphics board. Its makes me smile when I see products advertised
    as
    | > "low noise" yet they have high speed fan with ball bearings instead of
    | > slow
    | > speed with sleeve bearings.
    | >
    | > thanks,
    | >
    | > Beemer
    | >
    | >
    |
    Thanks. I have ordered one today

    Beemer
     
    Beemer, Apr 26, 2007
    #5
  6. Beemer

    Beemer Guest

    thanks....it works perfectly!

    Beemer
    |I have removed the small cr*ppy noisy fan on my k8N SLI with a Zalman
    | passive heatsink. The noise was too much to bear - on a $250 Mobo. Works
    Ok
    | for 2 years now. I suggest you do the same. Watch out for the heatsink
    | touching ANYTHING else...
    |
    |
    | | >
    | > | Beemer wrote:
    | > | > My nvidea chipset fan appears to be running at full speed although
    | > | > Cool'n'quiet is working for the CPU speed and CPU fan control.
    Should
    | > the
    | > | > chipset fan be controlled on my MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum?
    | > | >
    | > | > Beemer
    | > |
    | > | Cool N' Quiet adjusts FID and VID (multiplier and voltage value)
    | > | as a function of measured system load. If the system is "idle",
    | > | then CNQ uses the minimum multiplier and Vcore voltage. If the
    | > | load on the system is 100%, then the FID is adjusted to the maximum.
    | > | Adjustments are made on frequent intervals (like perhaps every time
    | > | the task scheduler runs).
    | > |
    | > | Fan control is completely separate from CNQ. A fan may have its own
    | > | built-in control method (like the thermistor in an Intel fan that
    | > | makes the Intel CPU fan sensitive to computer air temperature). A
    | > | fan can run at a constant speed (because no control method is
    | > | enabled, or because there is no power transistor next to the fan
    | > | header, to adjust the voltage).
    | > |
    | > | The Super I/O chip has temperature measurement channels. It also
    | > | has automatic or manual fan speed control options. BIOS code or
    | > | an application, can access the registers on the Super I/O, and do
    | > | some form of temperature based control. But if the fan headers
    | > | don't have a power transistor, to turn the Super I/O fan control
    | > | signal into something the fan can use, then the fan will be stuck
    | > | running at 100% speed. Many motherboard makers won't spend the extra
    | > | money to put a power transistor on each and every fan header. Some
    | > | premium boards only have two controlled channels.
    | > |
    | > | An example of a program for controlling the fans, is SpeedFan from
    | > | almico.com . But SpeedFan can only work, if the power transistor is
    | > | present on the fan header. SpeedFan can pretend to adjust all the
    | > | fan control channels it sees in a Super I/O chip, but without the
    | > | necessary power transistor, the adjustment would be for nothing.
    | > |
    | > | The chipset should have a more constant thermal load, than other
    | > | parts of the system. So there might be less reason for a control
    | > | system, to be adjusting the speed. The heat dissipated on the
    | > Northbridge,
    | > | would be proportional to the number of interfaces that are enabled on
    | > | the chip. For example, chipsets that have dual channel memory, run
    | > | cooler if only one channel is operating. It is possible to disable
    | > | the other channel, if it is known, by probing the SMBUS, that no DIMMs
    | > | are present, and the clocks and interface busses can be disabled
    | > | as a result. Similarly, a Northbridge may have 21 PCI Express lanes
    | > | terminating on it, and the more lanes that can be disabled, the
    | > | cooler the Northbridge would run. Some chipsets are now at the
    | > | 20W level, meaning a fan is an excellent idea, if the heatsink
    | > | used is a cheap one. Without a fan, in a case like that, the chip
    | > | is going to boil. Even motherboards with exotic passive cooling
    | > | methods, still rely on "spill air" from the CPU cooler, to help
    | > | with the cooling. That is why some motherboards include auxiliary
    | > | clip-on fans, for users who make extensive use of water blocks and
    | > | water cooling.
    | > |
    | > | Northbridges are also affected by overclocking. Some Northbridges
    | > | seem to track the multiplier being used on the processor, and the
    | > | internal Northbridge clock is influenced by the overclocking choices
    | > | being made. Some motherboards also allow changing the voltages used
    | > | on the Northbridge and Southbridge, which again could make a
    difference
    | > | to how much cooling was required.
    | > |
    | > | Chances are, if you remove the fan from your Northbridge, the chip
    | > | may end up running too hot. If you want to replace it, try something
    | > | like one of these. These still benefit from spill air from the
    | > | CPU or other fan. Convection may not be enough.
    | > |
    | > | ( Thermalright HR-05 series )
    | > | http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05.htm
    | > | http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05sli.htm
    | > |
    | > | Paul
    | >
    | > Paul,
    | >
    | > Thanks for the compehensive reply. I was not aware that the fan control
    | > was
    | > separate from cnq. I have the Nvidia Nforce2 chip which I believe is a
    | > combined Northbridge and Southbridge. I may put a simpler heatsink on
    it
    | > with a larger and slower fan. I have the same high speed noise problem
    | > on
    | > my graphics board. Its makes me smile when I see products advertised
    as
    | > "low noise" yet they have high speed fan with ball bearings instead of
    | > slow
    | > speed with sleeve bearings.
    | >
    | > thanks,
    | >
    | > Beemer
    | >
    | >
    |
    |
     
    Beemer, May 9, 2007
    #6
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