GA-8GPNXP Duo: some issues with IDE drives

Discussion in 'Gigabyte' started by Noël Danjou, Feb 21, 2005.

  1. Noël Danjou

    Noël Danjou Guest

    Hello,

    I just bought a Giga-Byte GA-8GPNXP Duo motherboard and I am encountering
    some issues with my IDE drives.

    I connected:
    - 1 Maxtor 40GB hard-drive as master on the IDE2 connector
    - 1 Maxtor 40GB hard-drive as slave on the IDE2 connector
    - 1 Plextor PX-130A as master on the IDE3 connector
    - 1 Plextor PX-712A as slave on the IDE3 connector


    I don't want to use RAID features. I just want the controler to run as a
    standard ATAPI controler. I only use IDE drives I don't have any SATA drives
    yet. I want to boot from the master HDD on IDE2.

    The motherboard BIOS version is F6.
    The GigaRAID BIOS version is 1.41.

    I configured the BIOS like this:
    - Hard Disk Boot Priority: 1. SCSI-0: IT8212
    - On-Chip Primary PCI IDE [Enabled]
    - SATA RAID/AHCI Mode [Disabled]
    - On-Chip SATA Mode [Auto]
    - Onboard H/W GigaRAID [Enabled]
    - GigaRAID Function [ATA]


    * After the message "Please wait for IDE scan", only the two hard drives are
    seen (UDMA6) but I was never able to see the PX-130A whatever settings I use
    and only saw the PX-712A drive a few times.

    * Another issue is that in the BIOS Setup, the "IDE HDD Auto-Detection"
    feature does not detect the parameters of my HDD.

    I tried all my drives in another PC and they all work correctly.

    Could you please tell me what is wrong with my configuration and my settings
    and why I cannot see my DVD-ROM drives and auto-detect my HDD from the BIOS.
    Please advise. Thank you.

    Noël
     
    Noël Danjou, Feb 21, 2005
    #1
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  2. Noël Danjou

    Ian Guest

    Am I being stupid or have you connected your drives to the Gigaraid instead
    of the IDE controller? At the very least you must set Gigaraid to IDE mode
    in BIOS.
     
    Ian, Feb 21, 2005
    #2
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  3. Noël Danjou

    BruceM Guest

    Oh.......... I been there.
    Well I forget most about how I ended up doing it exactly but ...........
    I'm not sure on that board because it's slightly dif to mine but tell
    me...........
    Are there 3 connectors that fit the IDE connector cable?
    Is one red & other 2 green?
    While I await your response I'll just comment that the one red one is the
    only "true" IDE one so connect the two optical drives to these & then you
    need to connect the HD's to IDE 2.
    You then need to go into the raid setup when booting & set it to (I think)
    NORMAL or (I don't have the manual here!) is it JAOD?
    See how you go & get back to me, but basically you need to set the raid up
    but just use it as a normal disk.
    You were right about booting from scsi.
    If you are installing XP I just hope you installed the scsi driver at the
    start of your XP installation?
    If you didn't, you can put the HD & CD on the red (IDE) connector, install
    XP & install the SCSI driver into it & THEN put it back on the other
    channel.
    Don't you just love gigabytes instructions?
    Get back to us.............



     
    BruceM, Feb 21, 2005
    #3
  4. Noël Danjou

    Noël Danjou Guest

    The controler is indeed configured to work as an ATAPI controler not a RAID
    controler. It is supposed to support 2 IDE ports with 2 devices on each.

    -nd
     
    Noël Danjou, Feb 22, 2005
    #4
  5. Noël Danjou

    Noël Danjou Guest

    Hello Bruce,

    Thanks for your reply.

    There are 3 connectors on the two IDE cables provided with the motherboard
    so I plugged 2 devices on each of them.

    When I set the GigaRAID controler to "ATA", I get a "GigaRAID ATAPI BIOS
    V1.41" message during the boot so it should mean that the controler is
    acting as a true IDE controler and it should be able to support 2 * 2
    devices.

    Whether I plug the optical drives to IDE3 or to IDE, the devices are not
    seen and the PX-130 is constantly blinking. It does work though since I
    successfully tested it on another PC and played a video DVD with it.

    When I previously tried different settings I saw the PX-712A a few times
    when plugged to IDE3 but I am not sure what the settings were. But I never
    saw the PX-130A so there still is an issue.

    There does not seem to be a setup when the GigaRAID is configured as an
    ATAPI controler.

    I was not able to install XP yet since I cannot use my DVD drive.

    Thanks.
     
    Noël Danjou, Feb 22, 2005
    #5
  6. Noël Danjou

    HammerToe Guest

    Why do you have the above on IDE2? Why not on IDE1 or 3 (or 4??)
    Opinion: not a good idea (the above). I suggest you use IDE2.
    I don't own one of these boards BUT I have several 7N400 Pro2's and
    in my experiences with this board, I would suggets that "it's not a
    good idea" to have CD/DVD (etc.) drives installed 'past' IDE1+2.

    I briefly EXPERIMENTED once with them (two drives) on IDE3 and they
    SEEMED to work to 'point'. I could at least READ disks in them BUT I
    could NOT BOOT from them (eg. to install an OS). However I did not
    exhaustively test...

    What I might suggest is try and configure your HW so that the two
    Maxtors are on IDE3 and the two Plextors are in IDE2 and see if that
    doesn't help get you where you want to go.

    You didn't 'say' what's on IDE1??? (unless I missed it). What are you
    using it for?
     
    HammerToe, Feb 22, 2005
    #6
  7. Noël Danjou

    Noël Danjou Guest

    Hello,

    I did not plug my disks on IDE1 because it is only ATA66/100 while my disks
    are ATA133.

    I tried to connect the two Maxtors to IDE3 and the two Plextors to IDE2 but
    to no avail. Both Maxtors detected but none of the Plextors.

    Now I replaced the Plextor PX-130A with my old Plextor CD-ROM PlexWriter
    PX-2410. I plugged my 2 Maxtors on IDE2 and the PX-2410 and the PX-712A on
    IDE3.

    The 2 Maxtors are detected and the PX-2410 is also detected but not the
    PX-712A.

    Why would the controllers only accept CD-ROM drives and not DVD-ROM drives?
    Could this be a compatibility issue of some kind?

    I placed a bootable Windows XP CD in the plextor. After the "Please wait for
    IDE scan" and I got a message saying "a bootable CD found" but I did not
    find a way to start it. Is there a key to hit?

    Now I tried to plug the two Plextors PX-2410 and PX-712A to IDE1 and I was
    able to boot from CD and to start the installation. I don't see the boot
    screen (where there is "DualBIOS") may be it is too fast? So I cannot say if
    the drives are listed there but I'd think so.

    When the PX-2410 is plugged to IDE1, in Setup > "Standard CMOS feature" >
    "IDE HDD Auto-detection" the PlexWriter does appear but not the PX-712A.

    I tried to start a XP installation from the CD, I hit F6 when the Setup told
    me but it asked for a manufacturer CD. I am not sure yet if the drivers are
    provided on the CD included with the motherboard.

    It's unfortunate that the ATAPI controller is not seen as a real IDE
    controller instead of seeing it as a SCSI controller.

    Your suggestions are welcome. Thank you.

    Noël
     
    Noël Danjou, Feb 22, 2005
    #7
  8. Noël Danjou

    WillieNillie Guest

    According to Gigabyte, and to ITE, the implimentation on the Pro2 does
    NOT support optical drives

    As for other statements, ALL of the controllers will support ATA 6,
    provided, you have a good 80 pin cable, AND you have just ATA 6.

    My suggestion is that you move the primary drives (Maxtors) to IDE 1
    put the Opticals on IDE 2

    any additional drives can be plugged into IDE 3 or IDE 4
     
    WillieNillie, Feb 22, 2005
    #8
  9. Noël Danjou

    Tim Guest

    If this is happening "It's unfortunate that the ATAPI controller is not seen
    as a real IDE
    controller instead of seeing it as a SCSI controller." then you have the ITE
    (? could it be the other SATA controller?) controller configured as RAID.

    The ITE controller has had several drivers and supporting bios versions.
    With one at least the controller will act as an ATA only controller with
    support for CD's etc. A counterpart driver exists that will do only RAID.
    Perhaps this is tied in with the BIOS firmware for the ITE I.E. maybe it is
    acting only as a RAID (SCSI) controller when enabled and the bios options
    are not reflecting this limitation. Just a theory.

    Forget about the transfer rate for your disc drives. The achieved difference
    between ATA 133 and 100 is negligable. Put all your peripherals on the stock
    standard IDE controllers built in and avoid the ITE. You still had enabled
    in the bios the OnChip SATA RAID - this too can be disabled. I.E. try and
    create a very plain old fashioned IDE setup and disable all RAID and other
    controllers that are not needed.

    General rule of thumb: IDE discs in the 1st IDE port, CD's / DVD's in second
    port. Place the faster / more modern optical drive as Master and the older
    as Slave. Check your jumpers. Master in the end of the cable, Slave in the
    middle.

    (OK so a lot of people will say this is unnecessary, but if you have it
    setup like that NO ONE will argue with you).

    If you still have trouble getting this going then, since you are doing an
    install (?) install the IDE Master drive on the 1st channel and the DVD
    Reader as master on the second and leave out all other peripherals that
    aren't essential. When XP is up and running, add the peripherals in one at a
    time checking first the bios to see that things are sensible, then boot into
    XP to confirm the devices come up 100%.

    HTH & BOL & Enjoy.
     
    Tim, Feb 23, 2005
    #9
  10. Noël Danjou

    BruceM Guest

    OK, sorry I been a while getting back to you but our clocks are dif to
    yours!!!
    Seems you have heaps of differing advice so not much point in confusing you
    more.
    Like I said. the board I was involved with was a dif one but same problem.
    When you try all the other suggestions & if they don't work, contact me?
    1. Forget about what you see of the flash screen & in bios. It doesn't show
    SCSI or RAID. It will still work.
    2. Put your optical drives on IDE 1.
    3. Put your HD's on IDE 2.
    4. Config IDE 2 as a raid. (normal)
    5. Install raid driver.
    6. Set bios to boot from SCSI.
    7. Set to boot from HD (1 or 2)
    OK, that is how it will finish up, but to get there I found it easier to
    start with CD & HD ONLY on IDE1 channel & install XP, then install SCSI
    driver, then put drives where I said & setup bios to suit.
    Let me know?



    =----
     
    BruceM, Feb 23, 2005
    #10
  11. Noël Danjou

    Ian Guest

    ALL additional (i.e. not IDE1/2) IDE controllers are shown as SCSI
    controllers in Windows. It's just the way it's done. The disks attached to
    these will show as SCSI disks, even though they are obviously not.
    Incidentally, the only way to check that they are in Mode6 (ATA133) is
    usually on the boot up display message. You won't get this info in Device
    manager with the additional controller/s.
     
    Ian, Feb 23, 2005
    #11
  12. Noël Danjou

    BruceM Guest

    I was referring to connectors for plugging the cables into the board?
     
    BruceM, Feb 23, 2005
    #12
  13. Noël Danjou

    BruceM Guest

    BruceM, Feb 23, 2005
    #13
  14. Noël Danjou

    Tim Guest

    No. That is not true.

    It depends on the device and how it is configured. For example, add in PCI
    IDE controllers will usually appear as IDE controllers. It depends on the
    manufacturer to a large extent. Add in RAID controllers will appear most
    usually as SCSI RAID - but not always. On board or On chip controllers may
    appear as IDE or SCSI or either depending on the BIOS settings - see the
    Intel ICH5R for an example. It can change itself from an 82801EB controller
    (IDE) to an 82801ER controller via 1 bios setting.

    The reason why SATA (and IDE sometimes) RAID controllers appear as SCSI is
    that that is the type of interface the manufacturer has chosen to present.
    SCSI has advantages even if the underlying device is IDE (or SATA) as it
    supports overlapped (async) IO at the Controller Level which offloads this
    task from the OS and in the case of Windows this reduces IO stalls because
    the device is already busy (in basic terms - its not like this at all but
    the gist is whats important). SATA is now supporting with NCQ these types of
    features as standard.

    - Tim
     
    Tim, Feb 23, 2005
    #14
  15. Noël Danjou

    HammerToe Guest

    AGREE.You will not NOTICE (subjectively) ANY DIFFERENCE in perf
    between ATA 100 and ATA 133. In fact, it's difficult to even MEASURE
    in many benchmarks since these are BURST transfer rates and the diff
    tends to only be even MEASUREABLE if the data you happen to need is in
    the DISKS CACHE and only needs to be XFERRED to Memory.

    If the data needs to be scooped up off a platter... no gain.
    Bottleneck here; can't do it fast enough in general to keep the cache
    full so no gain.
    checking first the bios to see that things are sensible, then boot
    into
     
    HammerToe, Feb 23, 2005
    #15
  16. Noël Danjou

    HammerToe Guest

     
    HammerToe, Feb 23, 2005
    #16
  17. Noël Danjou

    Noël Danjou Guest

    Thank you all for your suggestions and informations. I still did not get a
    reply from the local GigaByte support.

    I did disable the SATA controller after posting my message sorry for not
    mentioning it.

    I did try to plug the HDDs to IDE1 and the optical drives to IDE2 to no
    avail. The optical drives are still not detected.

    I am fed up with the IDE troubles and I now decided to order new SATA drives
    instead and to fully disable IDE H/W on the board. Hopefully this will work
    and with Windows XP SP1a CD I should not need any diskette to install the
    system and to detect all my drives.

    Thank you all.
     
    Noël Danjou, Feb 23, 2005
    #17
  18. Noël Danjou

    BruceM Guest

    Sorry to see that you took so much notice of others.
    Optical drives NEED to be on the ONLY true IDE channel. (IDE 1)
    Did you read that page I sent the address to?
    http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=1660&page=4
    All you experts who recommended him to put his HD's on IDE 1 ought to buy
    one of these boards & try doing it before they give out advice.
    ps. Even with you using SATA drives you will need to STILL put your optical
    drives on IDE 1. (The green socket on the m/board)
     
    BruceM, Feb 23, 2005
    #18
  19. Noël Danjou

    HammerToe Guest

    Not saying that you are wrong IN THIS CASE (with this MB) because
    'anythng's possible' BUT I just thought I would say that I've never
    seen or heard of an MB with two IDE Controllers (numbered 1+2) that
    REQUIRED 'optical drives' to be installed on IDE ***1***.

    In every case I've ever seen or heard of, EITHER IDE 1 OR 2 would be
    O.K. and the VAST majority of people wind up installing optical drives
    either as IDE 1 'Slave' or IDE 2 Master or Slave.

    In all of the implementations of EXTRA IDE controllers I've seen (IDE
    3+4), I've never come across one that did not advise AGAINST
    installing optical drives 'above' IDE 2.
    Again: don't want to start a 'war' here and you MAY be right with this
    particular board; but all I can say is that I would be very SURPRISED
    if what you've said is true. (Unless you are starting the IDE Count at
    IDE 0.
    I agree that going SATA will virtually certainly make no difference/be
    a probable waste of money.
     
    HammerToe, Feb 24, 2005
    #19
  20. Noël Danjou

    Noël Danjou Guest

    Hello all,

    Thanks again for all your support and detailed suggestions.

    Yes I did read the page at pcstats.com. Thanks for the link.

    The only connector of the true IDE is pink on this MB. The two IDE/RAID
    ports are green.

    There is "only" 3 IDE channels on this MB. IDE (the true IDE port) and
    IDE2/IDE3 the two ports of the RAID/ATA controller. There is no IDE0 or
    IDE4. IDE1 (channel 0) is simply called IDE while the RAID ports are IDE2
    and IDE3.

    I think I did try all the possible configurations, HDD and optical drives on
    either IDE or IDE 2/IDE3. Either HDDs on the lowest port and optical drives
    on the next one or the opposite. To no avail with the PX-130 and PX-712. I
    just did not try to mix HDD (master) and optical drive (slave) per channel
    but I am not sure it is worth trying.

    On another hand, the PX-W2412 is detected on *any* of the IDE ports, either
    IDE, IDE2 or IDE3 like the HDDs. The only drawback of connecting the
    PX-W2412 to IDE2 or IDE3 is that I cannot boot from it while the ATAPI BIOS
    detects that the CD-ROM is bootable. May be there is a key but I am not
    sure.

    I ordered two SATA HDD and two SATA DVD writers (I could not find a SATA
    DVD-ROM) so all my drives will now be SATA so that I can possibly disabled
    all IDE features in the BIOS.

    It seems like a device incompatibility to me or a possible bug in the BIOS
    or whatever. I know the drives are correctly set to master/slave on every
    channel. I built and tweaked tens of PCs as well.

    I cannot waste anymore time on those IDE issues. I just hope I am not
    wasting my money as well buying those SATA devices.

    Thanks again for all your help. I will let you know how it goes with the
    SATA devices.
     
    Noël Danjou, Feb 24, 2005
    #20
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