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Poll: How much battery drainage in shutdown/hibernation

Discussion in 'Laptops' started by BeadyBeady Bee, Apr 28, 2011.

  1. After months of testing, I finally submitted my laptop for
    troubleshooting. A new laptop with a 100% charged battery discharges
    5+ percent/day. A graph of my test data indicates that it will
    roughly discharge the battery in 17-20 days. This is in hibernation
    (whereas it's just over 4% in shutdown). The vendor's position is
    that this is normal because things like the clock require power. All
    I know is that my previous laptops were not nearly that voracious in
    hibernation and shutdown. The discharge was so unnoticable that I
    never bothered to test them. My bad, as I have no baseline figures
    (and this isn't even normally spec'd)

    I was hoping to do the wisdom-of-crowds thing and get people's
    anecdote with their laptops (when new). How long have you found that
    it takes for a laptop in shutdown or hibernation to completely
    discharge a 100% charged battery? Most people probably never tested
    this before, but perhaps you can give a gut-feel for the ball park
    percentage discharge per day in hibernation or shutdown.

    Thanks.
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, Apr 28, 2011
    #1
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  2. BeadyBeady Bee

    mike Guest

    as you give zero input on the make/model of the laptop or the battery
    technology involved, it's gonna be really hard to help you.
    I can tell you that it VARIES between models.
    Your problem seems to be shutdown, cause hibernate don't add much.

    You might want to look into BIOS options.
    Some things like wake on lan, if enabled might draw power in shutdown.

    If I'm not gonna use a laptop in 20 days, I take out the battery.
     
    mike, Apr 29, 2011
    #2
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  3. It's a Toshiba Satellite A660. But I'm also interested in anecdotes
    from other models so that I can get an idea of the spread.

    I disabled Wakeup-On-LAN and Sleep&charge (complete story at
    http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.laptops/browse_frm/thread/16762961230f369f).
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, Apr 29, 2011
    #3
  4. I should add that the problem is not the battery, since there is no
    noticable discharge when the battery is removed from the laptop. So
    this is a poll of the discharge caused by power draw from the laptop
    in hibernation and/or shutdown, with Wakeup-on-LAN and USB
    sleep&charge deactivated. Thanks.
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, Apr 29, 2011
    #4
  5. BeadyBeady Bee

    BillW50 Guest

    In
    This was very common problem with laptops with Celeron CPUs and still
    is. And for them, it seems like if you pull out the battery for a few
    seconds after it has been shutdown. Then reinsert the battery it was
    usually just fine. The story I heard was that most Celeron CPUs was not
    totally shutoff. They have different sleep modes and call them S1, S2,
    etc.

    Later I started to hear other complains about the battery draining after
    a couple of weeks in other CPU equipped laptops. I can't swear to it,
    but I believe they are all Intel CPUs. And it wasn't any of the Centrino
    types I don't think, but the I3, I5, or I7 ones I believe. So what type
    do you have?

    I know this battery draining thing is a big issue for many. Although it
    normally doesn't bother me at all. As I normally don't have any
    batteries in my over dozen laptops anyway. And when I use one, it is
    usually on AC on an UPS supply and still without batteries. Only when I
    am running portable, do I ever have a battery installed.
     
    BillW50, Apr 30, 2011
    #5
  6. Hi, Bill,

    Sorry, I don't think I was all that clear in my other thread. Yes, I
    did pop out the battery for a few seconds before reinserting. The
    problem persists despite doing that.

    The CPU is an i5.

    To me, it seems to be a design flaw for a laptop to discharge the
    battery when shut down or hibernated. What that implies is that the
    battery is actually powering some function in hibernation or
    shutdown. However, we all know (I hope) that if you remove the
    battery for some time before reinsertion, it shouldn't affect the
    resumption from hibernation one bit (or the boot up, in the case of
    shut down). All that is served by the discharging battery in
    hibernation/shutdown is to require the user to remove the battery if
    there is any chance that he/she will not use that laptop ahead of time
    (something that is not always known or planned ahead of time). If you
    put away the laptop with the expectation of using it soon, but it
    turns out that you don't...you could end up discharging the battery.
    Unfortunately, it is inadvisable to frequently discharge modern
    batteries to zero because is harmful to the lifetime of the battery.

    As well, if you're called away on a trip, your travel preparations
    checklist will include:

    1) Unplug laptop (in case a thunder storm occurs while you are
    away)

    2) Clear desk of papers enough to unplug cables to the laptop and
    flip it over to remove battery

    Considering that things are pretty hectic prior to travel, requirement
    #2 is just an added unwelcome complication that should be unnecessary
    if the laptop was properly designed. The real irony seems to be that
    laptops were properly designed (at least in this respect) in the past.
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, May 1, 2011
    #6
  7. BeadyBeady Bee

    AJL Guest

    http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Toshiba-Satellite-A660-151-Notebook.33805.0.html

    The A660 in this review is is said to use 0.4 watts when off. Further
    he says it has a 48 watt hour battery. That would give this LT
    considerably less than a week. However I find those figures hard to
    believe, maybe I 'm missing something.
    Well at least the power switch circuitry needs power or you couldn't
    turn it back on. But a half watt??
     
    AJL, May 2, 2011
    #7
  8. You're right. 0.4W and 48W.hr means 5 days to fully discharge. I
    don't experience it *that* bad. Still hoping to get representative
    anecdotes, though.
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, May 3, 2011
    #8
  9. BeadyBeady Bee

    BillW50 Guest

    In
    Well I don't disagree with you one bit. But this deal of off doesn't
    mean off started way back in the old TV vacuum tube days. And I forgot
    which company started it. But some TVs never turned off the vacuum tube
    heaters (although they ran at a lower voltage than the normal operating
    voltage was). So why did they do this? Simple, to allow almost instant
    on when you turned on the TV.

    This practice has continued to this very day. Lots of devices never
    turns everything off when you turn them off. If they run off of AC, you
    need an external power switch. And if they run off of batteries, you
    have to remove the batteries.

    Sure some devices uses so little power that you probably don't notice
    any power drain. But some are not so nice. Take my Palm IIIc for
    example. There is no real power off. As it is either living in standby
    or on. You have no other choice. And living in standby (the closest
    thing to off), drains the battery in about two weeks. And you have to
    disassemble the Palm to disconnect the battery. Thus why I leave it
    connected all of the time. But I do keep it on the charger most of the
    time because of this.

    My Asus 701/702 netbooks also has a battery drain problem. Which also
    drains the battery in about a two week period of time when off. Also
    odd, even without a battery installed and they are off, they are drawing
    1.5 watts of power from the AC. Although I have to admit, the USB ports
    still has power under these conditions. So that probably explains what
    most of that 1.5 watts are be used for.

    My Gateway MX6124 laptops also drain the battery in about 2 weeks being
    off. I never tested these Gateway M465 laptops, but I wouldn't be
    surprised if they drain the battery too.

    So I am with you that I too believe there should be an option for a real
    off on all devices. But I am afraid most manufactures care very much if
    we want this or not. :-(
     
    BillW50, May 5, 2011
    #9
  10. To maintian the data in memory so you don't need to resync it every
    time. I'd imagine that if you turn off Wake on (LAN PCI USB IR ETC) and
    the always on USB option you could reduce hibernation power draw a bunch.
     
    the wharf rat, May 5, 2011
    #10
  11. Hmm, interesting anecdote. I must have just been tremendously lucky.
    My only other two laptops never drew any noticable power when
    hibernated or off. Dell Inspiron 8000 and Compaq nc8230.
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, May 6, 2011
    #11
  12. That's one of the first things I did, to disable Wakeup-on-LAN and USB
    sleep & charge.
     
    BeadyBeady Bee, May 6, 2011
    #12
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