S1590 with AGP8x?

Discussion in 'Tyan' started by Eric, Jul 21, 2007.

  1. Eric

    Eric Guest

    I have an old Tyan s1590 which is currently running a Voodoo III 3000. A
    friend of mine just gave me a video card as a potential candidate for an
    upgrade. It turns out that it's an MSI MX4000-T64. This is an AGP8x card.
    I'm not sure that this card would be compatible with the s1590's AGP slot.
    Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks, Eric
     
    Eric, Jul 21, 2007
    #1
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  2. Eric

    Paul Guest

    There is some info here.

    http://www.playtool.com/pages/agpcompat/agp.html

    Working backwards using the new video card ID, the MX4000 is a
    "Universal AGP 3.0 Card". It works at 3.3V or 1.5V.

    Basically, if the card can be fitted into the AGP socket, it
    should be OK. I can find different images for the MX4000, and
    the example here, has both the 1.5V and 3.3V slots cut. This
    card should plug into any AGP slot.

    http://www.eyeswatching.com/Assets/product_images/K078MX4000-T128-80.jpg

    The other part of the equation, is the nature of the chipset. Some
    chipsets have more stable AGP interfaces than others. I learned that
    first hand, from an old ALI chipset. I don't know what chipset your
    S1590 uses. To make them stable, sometimes it requires reducing the
    AGP speed setting in the BIOS. In other cases, the BIOS will have
    "drive strength" settings for the AGP bus drivers on the Northbridge.

    The FTP files on the Tyan site are not archived, but you can dig up
    a bit of stuff for an old board, from web.archive.org . I expect
    a lot of the info here, is out of date and irrelevant.

    http://web.archive.org/web/20000517032907/www.tyan.com/support/html/s1590_agp_faq.html
    http://web.archive.org/web/20000517161056/http://www.tyan.com/support/html/s1590_faq.html

    Paul
     
    Paul, Jul 21, 2007
    #2
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  3. hi ,

    if this videocard isn't compatible with agp 1 or agp 2 ( which i doubt )
    and it would fit into the slot , you even might destroy it .
     
    wolfgang schneider, Jul 21, 2007
    #3
  4. Eric

    Eric Guest

    Thanks for this link. I will have to read through this page more carefully.
    Here's a link to MSI's page on this card, http://tinyurl.com/2xrpem. This
    link shows a larger image, http://tinyurl.com/2bpdy6. The exact model
    number is 8936-550 with serial number B0408078346. It's the one with the
    gold anodized heat sink in the photo on MSI's site. The card appears to
    have both the 1.5v and 3.3v slots cut into it's connector.

    The S1590 uses the Via MVP3 chipset. My current configuration has been
    running very smoothly since I built the computer almost 8 years ago. I sort
    of hate to make major changes though it would be nice to have a better video
    card to potentially play DVDs without any flicker. The machine has had an
    upgraded power supply to a unit from PC Power & Cooling as well as a couple
    of hard drive upgrades (currently running two 18GB U2W scsi drives, scsi
    Teac CDRW and scsi Toshiba DVD), and additional memory. I have a scsi zip
    drive as well but they've been made pretty much obsolete by the
    proliferation of USB flash drives.

    Thanks again for the links. I have a lot of this stuff printed out and
    saved from when I put the machine together. I will have to dig through it
    once more.

    Eric
     
    Eric, Jul 21, 2007
    #4
  5. Eric

    Eric Guest

    Thanks for the reply. I'm not so concerned with damaging the video card,
    I'm more concerned with damaging my motherboard. Please see my reply to
    Paul's post regarding the slot connector and which also has links to MSI's
    details of the card.

    Thanks again, Eric
     
    Eric, Jul 21, 2007
    #5
  6. Eric

    Paul Guest

    The playtool page lists the MVP3 as "AGP 3.3V Motherboard", more or less as
    expected judging by the age of the product. Since the table entry for the
    "Universal AGP 3.0 Card" shows it works with everything, it should not be
    a problem electrically.

    The way the card works, is the TYPEDEF pin specifies the card's preferred
    voltage. Your MX4000 would ask for 1.5V, if a "coin toss" is required. But
    the card will also run just fine with 3.3V, if the motherboard is old enough
    that it doesn't look at the TYPEDET signal.

    To give you an example, I have an FX5200 video card, of the same classification
    as the MX4000. I have a 440BX based motherboard, which is the same classification
    as your motherboard. I have tested two brands of FX5200 in that machine, and both
    work. Since the 440BX is pretty healthy as AGP slots go, I wasn't expecting
    a problem. If there is going to be a problem with old boards like that,
    it comes from the powering scheme.

    Years ago, I think I tried a TNT2 AGP card, and that didn't work. The theory
    at the time, was that the 3.3V consumption of that card, would have been too
    much for the motherboard. I believe, for whatever reason, that even if the
    board is only capable of supplying 3.3V, they provide the 3.3V from a
    motherboard regulator, rather than coming from the power supply directly.
    A partial reason for doing this, is some designs "goosed" the rail, and actually
    put out a bit more than 3.3V. That wouldn't have been possible if they took
    3.3V right from the power supply. Other than that, I honestly don't know why a
    3.3V I/O voltage only AGP motherboard, would use its own onboard regulator
    for powering.

    If this is an issue, when you plug in the MX4000 and turn it on, you'll get a
    black screen. There was no damage to my motherboard (presumably the regulator
    in question has overcurrent protection).

    What remains, is for you to research the stability of the MVP3. When I
    tried this search, it says there are 40,000 results. More than I can
    read right now :)

    http://groups.google.ca/groups/search?q=mvp3+agp

    I think I'd still give it a shot, as so far there is no indication the
    combination of parts is destructive.

    Paul
     
    Paul, Jul 21, 2007
    #6
  7. Eric

    Eric Guest

    That's one of the things I'm concerned about, that the MX4000 card could
    draw too much current and that the motherboard's circuits couldn't handle
    the demand.
    The Tyan S1590 is an AT board. Thus, there's no option to use the power
    supply for 3.3v. By the way, I recall reading some posts about people
    successfully using an Asus AGP-V3800 TNT2 card with their Tyan S1590 so
    maybe the MX4000 won't be too far of a stretch? Note that for some reason
    I'm not able to find those posts at this time.
    I'll have to take a closer look at the regulator chips on the motherboard.
    Perhaps there's a part number on them which will allow me to find the specs
    online. Still, I would then need to find out how much current the MX4000
    draws in order to do a comparison. Short of finding that information online
    somewhere, I'm not sure where to begin. I've tried doing a few Google
    searches but came up empty so far.
    Add 'tyan' to that search phrase and it cuts it down to a more manageable
    1800 or so. Still, I didn't find any useful info though.

    Eric
     
    Eric, Jul 22, 2007
    #7
  8. this is the only hint for downwardcompatibility i found in the list :
    "AGP 4X/2X and AGP Texturing Support" , but if you don't care so much
    for the card you can try because the mb shouldn't suffer from this .
    maybe paul comes up with one more experts statement .

    i would try anyway .
     
    wolfgang schneider, Jul 22, 2007
    #8
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