Safari 4 (beta)

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Warren Oates, Feb 24, 2009.

  1. Warren Oates

    Heli Guest

    That would be a good thing. But you would need extra coding to check
    for that in the system, don't you?
    You see, my problem with Apple is - from my own experience - that they
    don't really care about old customers, they seem to develop for the
    buyer of a new computer. So for now, I say: stick to the system that
    came with your computer, only update for security and bug reasons.
    And be very, very careful about the big updates. A percentage of people
    will get into trouble with them. Even if it's only 5% it's too much.
    I don't want bling, like Places, Faces or Top Site, I want a lean, mean
    smoothly working machine.
    Heli, Feb 26, 2009
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  2. Warren Oates

    CatStephan Guest

    I totally agree. And your other posts. Back to Safari 3 (or non beta 4).
    Just my ¤0.02.
    CatStephan, Feb 26, 2009
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  3. Warren Oates

    VAXman- Guest

    Hmm... I have it installed on my 17" Powerbook with 10.4.11. I wonder
    if Apple or you have tested it on Tiger.

    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

    Today's commodities market: Snake Oil: $787B/bbl

    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"
    VAXman- , Feb 26, 2009
  4. Warren Oates

    Warren Oates Guest

    Stop being such a pompous precious ass. I thought our main purpose here
    the was the betterment of our experiences with our Apple stuff.

    Here's some kill-filery for you:

    Warren Oates, Feb 26, 2009
  5. Warren Oates

    Warren Oates Guest

    I don't use Safari much. Opera have had Top Sites for a while now (Speed
    Dial) and a snap-back button that usually works pretty well until it
    doesn't. I always find myself back at Firefox 3 though. It's like a
    comfy old pair of nipple-clamps. There's probably an add-on that will do
    what Top Sites does.

    Like I said before, I like the Cover Flow approach, although there seems
    to be a bug in the "search history" where I can't get the damned
    keyboard focus out of the Google search bar and into the "navigation"
    bar so I can page through with the arrow keys. Maybe I'm just doing it
    wrong. (No, not looking for CMD-Arrow, that does something useful too,
    but. CTL-Arrow changes my Spaces).
    Warren Oates, Feb 26, 2009
  6. Warren Oates

    Warren Oates Guest

    Crap. I have a Sawtooth g4 (upped to 1.6) happily running 10.5.6. Moves
    along nicely swiftly. I'm using it as secondary backup server via its
    Firewire ports, and to move DivX into my living room. Bling is Facebook
    and YouTube and Pandora and Hulu and iTunes (although I use iTunes).
    Warren Oates, Feb 26, 2009
  7. Warren Oates

    Warren Oates Guest

    Warren Oates, Feb 26, 2009
  8. Counter to the facts! They developed and supported Classic to help
    with the transition from OS9 to OSX. They developed and supported
    Rosetta to help with the transition from PPC to Intel. With the
    exception of a very old iBook, all of them (including a mirror door
    G4 dual 1.44GHz) are running 10.5. The iBook is running 10.4 since
    it's not supported at 10.5. That doesn't upset me. It's a G3 proc
    which is (at least) 3 processors behind (G3, G4, G5, Intel).

    Apple does end support for old systems and old softwre. No surprise
    there. And frankly, I would hate to see them limit their development
    to the oldest system still in general use! That would limit my brand
    new Macbooks to the funcitonality of my iBook. No thanks!
    I want the new functionality. And in fact, the new OS runs *faster*
    on some of that older hardware than the OS that came with the machine!
    Duh. Anyone who works in IT can tell you this. I never upgrade my
    main work machine to a new release without running the update on a
    second machine that is not mission-critical and ensuring my applications
    work. If it was just a home machine, I'd do a disk image copy, do
    the upgrade and if things didn't work out, restore the image. Easy to
    do with several freely available programs and a cheap USB2 external disk

    Duh. Anyone who works in IT can tell you this. I never upgrade my
    main work machine to a new release without running the update on a
    second machine that is not mission-critical and ensuring my applications
    work. If it was just a home machine, I'd do a disk image copy, do
    the upgrade and if things didn't work out, restore the image. Easy to
    do with several freely available programs and a cheap USB2 external disk.
    True always. No way to avoid that. Happens even with my production
    servers running Red Hat. That's why I test. And find either fixes
    or work arounds. If I can't, I stick with the older release until the
    problem is fixed. For example, I still have one system running 32-bit
    RH4 because the app doesn't like (and nobody can figure out why) 64-bit
    RH4, and they haven't updated for RH5 yet (in process). But I'm fine
    with that.
    Those 5% should not prevent Apple from developing new systems & software.
    They can always stick to the current release until the issue is solved
    or they find a work around.
    Then don't use them. In almost every case, you can turn off the 'bling'
    (as you call it). Don't get me wrong - I know where you are coming from.
    It's why I use Gentoo on my home server - I can make it a lean, mean
    computing machine without anything I don't want. That said, I have found
    that the things about the Mac that annoy me I can turn off or ignore, or
    get a 3rd party app that does what I want how I want.


    Stephen Adams, Feb 26, 2009
  9. Warren Oates

    Philo D Guest

    interesting notion of removal
    Philo D, Feb 26, 2009
  10. Warren Oates

    Doc O'Leary Guest

    Because it's too stupid to be a bullet point, let alone a major focus
    for an update. Every GB they shave off only represents pennies in HD
    space. They could reduce the size of the OS to zero and it would only
    be worth $1 to me, and only if my time bothering with the update itself
    were free.
    Doc O'Leary, Feb 26, 2009
  11. Warren Oates

    AES Guest

    Right! And if you want one or more folders of "favorites" or "top
    sites" at the top of your Safari Bookmarks Menu, just create these
    folders and name them " Top Sites xxx" (or whatever you like), **with
    one or more blank spaces at the start of the name**.

    [Or " € Top Sites" if you really want to highlight those folders.]

    The top items in my Bookmarks Menu are

    Google (URL)
    Favorite reading (Folder with NYT, HuffPost, etc)
    Favorite sites (Ones I use daily)
    Google sites (All the Google special sites)
    New URLs (where I dump new URLs until sorted)
    Air travel sites
    Apple & Mac Info

    and so on, alphabetically. BookDog, runnng invisibly in background,
    resorts the entire menu every time Safari shuts down.

    Does Safari 4 offer this built-in alphabetizing?
    AES, Feb 26, 2009
  12. Warren Oates

    Daniel Cohen Guest

    Yes, but it is a publicbeta.

    Partly intended to check whether it works ok, but one can also hope that
    if enough people complain about "features" the final version will revert
    to the old behaviour.
    Daniel Cohen, Feb 26, 2009
  13. This ignores the cost of using the LAST MB of disk on your system. In
    other words, if my disk is full (or nearly so), the reduction begins to
    represent a real savings. I don't have to spend the money to replace the
    drive or the system (if the drive can't be upgraded).

    Every MB saved is one more song I can have in iTunes without running
    out of disk. And that's worth something to me.

    And this doesn't take into account that smaller footprints on disk
    may well represent similar reductions in memory usage (ie the code
    that needs to be in RAM is smaller), thus allowing more efficient
    use of the RAM that I have (especially important if you are running
    a VM like Parallels).

    Stephen Adams, Feb 26, 2009
  14. Warren Oates

    M-M Guest

    M-M, Feb 26, 2009
  15. Warren Oates

    Warren Oates Guest

    I buy hard disks like I buy butter or cream. When I run out of cream, my
    coffee doesn't taste so good (although, yeah, my first cup of espresso
    in the morning is strong and black and occasionally has a nice dram of
    Armagnac in it).
    Warren Oates, Feb 26, 2009
  16. Warren Oates

    Davoud Guest

    George Kerby:
    You missed that part of my post that reads "There are consequences to
    kill-filing people, of course, and I accept the consequences of my

    In other words, since I'm not blaming you, or any one else, it's not
    your place to criticize me.

    Did you by any chance read Michele's post? I googled it and here's what
    I said about it:

    Davoud, Feb 26, 2009
  17. Code to remove code you don't need: 10MB at most. Should be a lot less,
    but let's pick the worst possible value. Space saved: 300MB. Seems like
    a good trade.
    My experience disagrees. Every release of Mac OS X since the time I
    bought my last PowerBook G4 to the day I gave it to my dad improved its
    performance and increased its capabilities, and the only hardware
    upgrades I ever performed on it in that period were hard drive swaps
    when one died. Sure, I didn't have access to all of the capabilities
    available to newer machines, but I still had everything I had before
    plus some.
    If you never want better performance or new features, that's the right
    way to do it. But if you hold the features you use constant, every
    release of Mac OS X has improved performance.
    Do you have a source for 5%? I expect it's more like 1%. That's probably
    less than the percentage of people who have a cold at any particular
    If that's true, you should be cheering Snow Leopard rather than passing
    on it. It isn't about "no new features," it's just *focused* on making
    things lean, mean and smoothly working.
    Steven Fisher, Feb 26, 2009
  18. Warren Oates

    Heli Guest

    I do hope so. If the speed is indeed faster then that's a positive
    So far all the complaints about iWeb3 have not resulted in an update
    yet. Today two more people had a serious crash that damaged their
    template. Now I know that Safari is not as important as iWeb, if things
    go wrong it is easy to install Firefox.
    But Apple is doing some strange things.
    And a system update is in the offing:
    "Those people familiar with the matter say the update, like those that
    came before it, will bundle a plethora of bug fixes spanning a wide
    range of system components and services. In its current pre-release
    form, the software reportedly boasts nearly six dozen code corrections
    and weighs a hefty 440 megabytes in barebones form."

    Apple has announced that Snow Leopard will be much smaller, now they
    are adding MBs.

    Some independent news about Safari4:
    Apple launches Safari 4 beta that looks like Windows
    Paul Thurrott reviews Apple¹s Safari 4 Public Beta for Windows:
    ŒHorrible, cluttered and ugly¹
    A Hands On Look at Safari 4's (Crashy) Eye Candy
    Heli, Feb 26, 2009
  19. Warren Oates

    Tim McNamara Guest

    OK, I looked it up. Michelle wrote:

    "Easy, but a bit complex, to do. 1.  Open two windows in Safari. 2.
     In window 1, open Top Sites and click the Edit button. 3.  In window
    2, navigate to the site you want. 4.  Drag the URL icon/button from
    window 2 to Window 1. That URL will remain in Top Sites, in the
    location you put it, until you move or remove it."

    No reflection on Michelle here, but this a description of a feature
    I'm going to use!? Get serious![/QUOTE]

    Apparently your large, squishy and hypertrophied frontal lobes (with ego
    to match) overlooked the fact that this is BETA software. You want
    perfectly polished and honed software? Beta-anything not so much your

    Tim McNamara, Feb 26, 2009
  20. Warren Oates

    Tim McNamara Guest

    LOL! Me three!
    Tim McNamara, Feb 26, 2009
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