Setting Start Time for Time Machine Backups

Discussion in 'Apple' started by TaliesinSoft, Apr 13, 2010.

  1. TaliesinSoft

    TaliesinSoft Guest

    What I would like is to be able to set the exact time at which the
    hourly Time Machine backups take place. For example, 1:00, 2:00,
    3:00.....

    The reason for this is that there is a conflict between SuperDuper! and
    Time Machine if Time Machine is running when a scheduled SuperDuper!
    backup initiates, the result being a failure of the SuperDuper! backup.
    This happens if borth the Time Machine and SuperDuper! backups are to a
    Time Capsule.

    So what I want to do is to make sure that Time Machine is not running
    at the time a SuperDuper! backup initiates.

    Many thanks in advance for suggestions and such!
     
    TaliesinSoft, Apr 13, 2010
    #1
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  2. TaliesinSoft

    TaliesinSoft Guest

    After making my post I discovered what looks like it will do the job in
    TimeMachineEditor. We shall see!
     
    TaliesinSoft, Apr 13, 2010
    #2
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  3. TaliesinSoft

    Nick Naym Guest


    Been using it for quite some time. In fact, I'm still using v.2.2 -- I
    didn't upgrade to v. 2.5, as I didn't like the idea of having a daemon
    intrude into my system (which, as I understand, is how 2.5.x operates -- a
    change that was made when SL was released).
     
    Nick Naym, Apr 14, 2010
    #3
  4. TaliesinSoft

    Király Guest

    That sounds like a bug with SD!. Have you checked with Shirt Pocket
    support?
     
    Király, Apr 14, 2010
    #4
  5. TaliesinSoft

    TaliesinSoft Guest

    I've had several discussions with Dave Nanian of Shirt Pocket regarding
    this, and am trying to narrow down the exact circumstances of the
    failure.
     
    TaliesinSoft, Apr 14, 2010
    #5
  6. TaliesinSoft

    Nick Naym Guest

    I don't think it's a SuperDuper!/Time Machine conflict/bug, per se (see, for
    example, http://www.shirt-pocket.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5006). I'd be
    inclined to suspect it's somehow related to Time Capsule.
     
    Nick Naym, Apr 14, 2010
    #6
  7. TaliesinSoft

    TaliesinSoft Guest

    I purchased my Time Capsule in early January of this year and in
    addition to the Time Machine hourly backups there have also been two
    nightly scheduled SuperDuper! backups to the Time Capsule. Thee are
    also Everything ran without any apparent problems until I upgraded to
    OS X 10.6.3 and then I started having frequent failures of one of the
    SuperDuper! scheduled backups, the one which backed up my computer. The
    other SuperDuper! backup which didn't fail was that of an external
    drive. With a bit of experimenting I established that the failures
    apparently occurred if Time Machine was running when the backup of the
    computer itself was initiated. I've installed TimeMachineEditor and
    have programmed it to have my hourly Time Machine backups occur on the
    hour, and have set my nightly SuperDuper! backups to initiate at 15
    minutes past the hour so that there is essentially no chance that there
    would be an overlap between Time Machine and the backups, and this
    seems to be eliminating the problem, time will tell. I will be keeping
    Dave Nanian of Shirt Pocket, the implementors of SuperDuper!, updated
    as to whether my workaround eliminates the problem. I'd be interested
    if there are others who have experienced the same problem.
     
    TaliesinSoft, Apr 14, 2010
    #7
  8. TaliesinSoft

    Nick Naym Guest


    I assumed that it was somehow related to Time Capsule, as I don't have Time
    Capsule and have never experienced a conflict between SD! and TM. Though,
    admittedly, they rarely run at the same time, on those occasions when they
    happen to be running simultaneously -- say, when TM is going through a deep
    traversal and it's still backing up when SD! kicks in -- they never
    conflict. I'm currently on SL 10.6.3 (see sig), SD! 2.6.2, and TME 2.2.
    (BTW: Did you get the installer I sent you?)

    The only times SD! has failed on me has been when the target volume
    (external drive) was too full (i.e., nearing capacity) and a large file on
    the source volume (internal drive) was being modified while the backup was
    occurring. But that's to be expected. (FWIW, open MS Office apps -- even if
    they're not being actively used -- have a habit of making db changes in the
    middle of backups!) But, as I said above, I've not had any apparent SD!
    problems due to overlapping backups with TM.
     
    Nick Naym, Apr 14, 2010
    #8
  9. TaliesinSoft

    TaliesinSoft Guest

    On 2010-04-14 09:12:01 -0500, Nick Naym said:

    [in reference to TimeMachineEditor]
    I did get the installer you sent (many thanks) but by the time I
    received it I had already installed TimeMachineEditor and it seems to
    be working fine, forcing the Time Machine backups to always run on the
    hour, e.g. 1:00, 2:00, 3:00.... This allows me to schedule the
    SuperDuper! backups at a time when Time Machine is certain to not be
    running.
     
    TaliesinSoft, Apr 14, 2010
    #9
  10. TaliesinSoft

    Nick Naym Guest

    Of course it works...the thing I don't like about the Snow Leopard version
    is that unlike previous versions, it no longer sets a system parameter to
    tell TM when to back up, but instead installs a daemon that runs in the
    background and requires you to manually shut off TM. All the advantages of
    the Leopard version are now gone. Why be forced to rely on a (by definition,
    intrusive) background daemon, not be able to see TM active, and not have a
    reliable and visible indicator of when the last and next backup occurred?
    That's why I stayed with the last Leopard version (2.2).

    Huh? That's pretty much TM's default. What have you changed?

    I find that hourly backups are unnecessarily too often. I've set TME to
    schedule Calendar Intervals every 2 hours during normal working hours, every
    3 hours at night until midnight, and none after that.
    TME 2.2 will do/does that very nicely.
     
    Nick Naym, Apr 14, 2010
    #10
  11. Huh? in Leopard, you had to manually shut off TM if you wanted it to stop.
    That's what the ON/OFF switch in the TM Preferences was for.

    Curious, I can easily tell that my latest backup was today at 9:28 AM, and
    that my next backup will be today at 10:25 AM. It's right there in the TM
    Preferences.
    He said "on the hour", not "every hour".
     
    Michelle Steiner, Apr 14, 2010
    #11
  12. TaliesinSoft

    TaliesinSoft Guest

    On 2010-04-14 11:33:15 -0500, Nick Naym said:

    [commenting on how I set TimeMachineEditor to backup "on the hour"]
    My experience has been that although Time Machine's default is to
    backup hourly the times of the backups are not synchronized to the
    hour. That is, and I just opened Time Machine to check, and found a
    series of backups that ran at roughly 45 minutes after the hour. My
    gutsy is that the default is based upon when the Mac is started.

    And after having set the schedule with TimeMachineEditor the backups
    are now initiated according to the schedule I set, that is, 1:00, 2:00,
    3:00....
     
    TaliesinSoft, Apr 14, 2010
    #12
  13. This seems still to be a workaround. The proper way to do this would be
    to run either of both from a script that waits until the backup is done
    and then starts the other.


    Jochem
     
    Jochem Huhmann, Apr 14, 2010
    #13
  14. This seems still to be a workaround. The proper way to do this would be
    to run either of both from a script that waits until the backup is done
    and then starts the other.[/QUOTE]

    Why would that be the proper way? So long as TM can schedule itself, why
    not just use a utility to tell it what time to start, and compute the
    schedule from that point onward?
     
    Michelle Steiner, Apr 14, 2010
    #14
  15. Because this way you will have to guess when TM will be done with its
    backup and if it isn't you get a problem. As most workarounds it will
    work most of the time and may still bite you later on.


    Jochem
     
    Jochem Huhmann, Apr 14, 2010
    #15
  16. Because this way you will have to guess when TM will be done with its
    backup and if it isn't you get a problem. As most workarounds it will
    work most of the time and may still bite you later on.[/QUOTE]

    After the initial backups, neither will take more than a half hour, so
    schedule the other one at the half-hour mark.
     
    Michelle Steiner, Apr 14, 2010
    #16
  17. TaliesinSoft

    Nick Naym Guest

    After the initial backups, neither will take more than a half hour,[/QUOTE]

    Maybe, maybe not.
     
    Nick Naym, Apr 14, 2010
    #17
  18. TaliesinSoft

    Király Guest

    I have had both SuperDuper! and Time Machine backups take longer than 30
    minutes. Not often, but it happens. Running 10.5.8 on a G4 with 120GB
    of used space on my boot drive.
     
    Király, Apr 14, 2010
    #18
  19. TaliesinSoft

    Király Guest

    ....and there is just such a way. The following Terminal command will
    turn Time Machine off:

    defaults write /Library/Preferences/com.apple.TimeMachine AutoBackup
    -bool NO

    And this one will turn it back on:

    defaults write /Library/Preferences/com.apple.TimeMachine AutoBackup
    -bool YES

    Have SD! run the first one before it starts backing up, and the second
    one after it finishes. You can tell SD! to do this in Options ->
    Advanced.
     
    Király, Apr 14, 2010
    #19
  20. TaliesinSoft

    Nick Naym Guest

    Nice.

    But I remain suspicious about the whole "problem": There is no inherent
    reason that SD! should fail if it and TM run simultaneously -- unless there
    is something unusual going on that is somehow unique to the way SD! and/or
    TM interoperate with TC.
     
    Nick Naym, Apr 14, 2010
    #20
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