Tiger eats Classic

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Neill Massello, Apr 13, 2005.

  1. Neill Massello, Apr 13, 2005
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  2. Neill Massello

    Dave Seaman Guest

    Classic has been an optional install for some time now. All it means is
    that Classic was not installed on the machine where they did the
    Dave Seaman, Apr 13, 2005
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  3. The Classic pref pane appears even when no OS 9 System Folder is present
    on any mounted drive.
    Neill Massello, Apr 13, 2005
  4. The screen shot I referred to does have an Ink pane.

    Because that's the way it worked in 10.3 and 10.2. Panes like Ink and
    Bluetooth only appear when the system detects the optional hardware. The
    Classic pane always appears, even if no OS 9 System Folder is installed
    on any mounted drive.

    Check the following pages:

    Check any page about Tiger on Apple's web site. If you find any
    reference to Classic or any language such as "runs your old Macintosh
    applications", please post the URL.

    Anybody who wants Classic support in Tiger should wait for the reports
    from early adopter to appear in May.
    Neill Massello, Apr 13, 2005
  5. Neill Massello

    Dave Seaman Guest

    Even if Classic is not installed?
    Dave Seaman, Apr 13, 2005
  6. Neill Massello

    Dave Seaman Guest

    You seem to think that "Classic" is identical to an OS 9 System Folder.
    It's not. The question is, does that computer have a
    /System/Library/CoreServices/Classic\ Startup.app installed? As I said
    before, that has been an optional install for a while now.
    Dave Seaman, Apr 13, 2005
  7. I'm guessing it no longer breaks NDA[*] to note that Classic
    is present and starts up in late developer seeds of Tiger.
    I seriously doubt it has been removed for the release.
    [*] if not, well _mea culpa_...
    Michael Siemon, Apr 13, 2005
  8. Neill Massello

    Chris Moore Guest

    Not Apple but Tiger training that includes Classic:
    Chris Moore, Apr 13, 2005
  9. Classic support is part of the current (10.3) OS X installation. It is
    not an option. Whether or not you have installed an OS 9 System Folder,
    your OS X system will include a Classic pref pane (in
    /System/Library/PreferencePanes), Classic Startup application (in
    /System/Library/CoreServices), and whatever other bits and pieces are
    necessary to run OS 9 applications in the Classic environment.
    Neill Massello, Apr 13, 2005
  10. No, it hasn't. Classic support is part of the current OS X. There is no
    option to exclude it when running the OS X 10.3 installer.
    Neill Massello, Apr 13, 2005
  11. Neill Massello

    clw Guest

    OK, Guys, we have had a lot of fumbling around here. IS Classic
    supported in Tiger?

    Does it come with Tiger or do we have to have an old version of 9.2.2 to
    load after upgrading to Tiger?

    Does Apple realize that most of the current support for Classic is a
    dependence on Word 5.1a?
    clw, Apr 14, 2005
  12. Neill Massello

    Dave Seaman Guest

    There is no option to exclude Classic. There is also no option to
    include Classic. If you want Classic on a new Mac such as the G5 I set
    up last September, you can't do it by running the system installer; you
    have to go through an extra step: you mount the disk marked "Additional
    Software & Apple Hardware Test" and run the installer on that disk. It
    turns out that the "Additional Software" is Classic.

    I should add that I reinstalled the system right away because I wasn't
    happy with the default configuration. I didn't spend a lot of time
    exploring first, so it's entirely possible that the machine may have been
    configured with Classic as it came from the factory. But when I
    reinstalled from the system disk, there was no System Folder until I ran
    the installer from the other disk.

    What I don't know, because I didn't bother to check at the time, is how
    much of Classic is included in the "Additional Software". I know it
    includes a System Folder and an "Applications (Mac OS 9)" folder, but I
    don't know whether it includes "Classic Startup.app" and the
    Classic.prefPane. But anyway, my point is that you can't conclude
    anything about Classic support under Tiger just from the fact that it may
    not be included in the default installation. If part of Classic is a
    separate, optional install, then it could all be an optional install.
    Dave Seaman, Apr 14, 2005
  13. We'll know before 30 April.

    No retail OS X release has come with an OS 9 installer since 10.1. It
    was an extra $20 or so by mail for purchasers of 10.2 and 10.3. No
    indication that a similar update offer will be available for those who
    buy Tiger.

    There's also no indication that the Tiger installer will delete existing
    OS 9 system and application folders. Previous OS X installers didn't. So
    long as you don't use the Erase and Install option, you shouldn't have
    to install 9.2.2 again.
    Neill Massello, Apr 14, 2005
  14. Which you could quite reasonably argue is a bad thing and getting worse,
    since an increasing percentage of users aren't going to have (or for
    that matter need) the underlying software to support classic.
    There are a whole lot of features that don't get mentioned on any of
    those pages. One could assume that means they're absent. One could just
    as easily assume they're basic and/or boring and aren't worth the bytes
    to mention yet again. (Gadzooks. Apparently Tiger has no FTP support.
    It's not mentioned anywhere in the site.)

    I don't think we'll have to wait that long. I'd be surprised if it takes
    as long as 4/29 for someone to report in on their official released

    Gregory Weston, Apr 14, 2005
  15. Then *you* are the one who has confused Classic with an OS 9 System
    Folder. Run an OS X installer on a Mac, and it will install the Classic
    pref pane, startup app, and other elements of Classic support.

    The rest of your post indicates that you may also be confused about the
    differences between a retail installer set and the install and restore
    discs that are bundled with new Macintosh hardware.
    Neill Massello, Apr 14, 2005
  16. Neill Massello

    timberfish Guest

    What are you talking about? My laptop not only came with Panther 10.3
    (Classic already installed) but when I did a clean re-install of
    Panther I had the option to install Classic during setup.
    timberfish, Apr 14, 2005
  17. Neill Massello

    clw Guest

    It did come with the 10.3.5 disks I got with my new iMac G-5.
    clw, Apr 14, 2005
  18. Neill Massello

    Dave Seaman Guest

    You conveniently snipped the part where I talked about the other parts of
    My point all along has been that it is possible to make Classic a
    separate install, not included in the default OS X. I don't know whether
    Tiger does that or not, but it doesn't change my assessment of what is
    Dave Seaman, Apr 14, 2005
  19. Really? I may be ignorant on the matter being so new to the Mac
    platform, but Office 2004 for the Mac has a newer version of Word
    (Excel and Powerpoint too) that are OS X apps.
    Daniel Juarez, Apr 14, 2005
  20. Neill Massello

    Orchid Guest

    This is a rather glib response. FTP is basic functionality included in a
    variety applications. Classic is essentially support for an entire OS
    within another OS. It's not a trivial issue that one can take for
    granted because it's always going to be included, particularly since
    Apple clearly wants to phase out Classic. Eventually, some version of
    their OS will not include Classic support. It could be this one.

    I don't think "boring" or obvious features are excluded from being
    mentioned. In the Overview section, it mentions obvious things like
    networking to other computers. That's far more mundane than mentioning
    support for Classic. It wouldn't have broken the bit bank if they had
    listed OS 9 Classic under the compatibility section along with Windows
    or if they'd have included a line on it in the huge list of technical
    specs. It's nearly a glaring omission on Apple's part.

    I'd also like to see confirmation that Classic support is included in
    Tiger if someone has found an URL which mentions it.

    Orchid, Apr 14, 2005
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