UPS Recommendations?

Discussion in 'Asus' started by (PeteCresswell), Sep 25, 2006.

  1. Have had an APC "Back UPS XS 1500" for several years.

    It works, but it seems to me like APC is selling batteries. To wit, the thing's
    software started telling me it was replacement time and "helpfully" pointing me
    to APC's battery sales site.

    Went down to Radio Shack instead and got a couple of the things that seem to
    spec identically. Lifted the harness from the old set and replaced them.

    But either I messed up on a connection somewhere or APC as something proprietary
    built into their batteries.

    Either way, I'm shopping.

    Anybody got something that:
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    1) They're happy with.

    2) Takes some sort of standard widely-available battery?

    3) Will run 400 watts for, say, 30 minutes or more?
     
    (PeteCresswell), Sep 25, 2006
    #1
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  2. (PeteCresswell)

    Mark A Guest

    First, I would monitor the reserve time, and until it goes down below an
    acceptable level, there is probably no need to replace the battery.

    There are companies that sell third party batteries for most UPS models that
    are cheaper than the APC brand. I would check out some sites as
    www.batteriesplus.com where you can get a replacement for about $60.00.
    Radio Shack is usually a rip-off.

    http://www.batteriesplus.com/produc...American-Power-Conversion)/SmartUPS-1500.aspx

    Of course, it sounds like you may have damaged the unit some how, in which
    case buying a new battery will not help. You should be able to put the old
    battery back in and see if it works.
     
    Mark A, Sep 25, 2006
    #2
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  3. I'd recommend APC. And I've never seen an APC UPS with proprietary
    batteries, and I've replaced a dozen or so batteries with non-APC
    batteries with no problems. My guess is you somehow messed up. UPS
    batteries do fail, usually after 3 ot 6 years, and the cost of replacing
    batteries at the end-user level can approach the cost of the entire UPS
    (we can't buy them in 1,000 unit lots like APC can). But next time, get
    the APC p/n for the batteries for your unit, then check E-Bay. You will
    be amazed at what you find ... exact replacement batteries from many
    sources far cheaper (including shipping, which is often as much as the
    battery (lead is heavy)) than APC or, for that matter, Radio Shack.
     
    Barry Watzman, Sep 25, 2006
    #3
  4. (PeteCresswell)

    Mitch Crane Guest

    I used a sealed lawn mower battery. It's been working great for over a
    year.

    http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a126/NghtShd/DSCF3082.jpg
     
    Mitch Crane, Sep 25, 2006
    #4
  5. (PeteCresswell)

    DK Guest

    I use a new car battery too.

    However, I noticed an odor in the room and traced it to the 'sealed'
    battery. So I drilled a hole in the wall and set it on the porch so
    my family doesn't have to breath hydrocloric acid fumes.
     
    DK, Sep 25, 2006
    #5
  6. (PeteCresswell)

    Mitch Crane Guest

    Yeah, my plan was to make a box with a vent to the outside, but I've never
    detected any outgassing. If there is any it isn't much. (Famous last
    words?)
     
    Mitch Crane, Sep 25, 2006
    #6
  7. (PeteCresswell)

    Ed Medlin Guest

    The APC Back-UPS 1500 is about the perfect UPS for me. We have an electrical
    contractor nearby that has a retail store and they carry about all the major
    manufacturer batteries for about 1/2 the price of the APC ones. I have used
    my 1500 for about 2.5yrs now and just went and got a spare and installed and
    tested it and it worked fine. It is non-branded (OEM) but at least I am
    ready for when mine does fail. My battery still reads full (40mins uptime)
    so I may not need it for awhile. It has been a lifesaver for us. We live in
    a very rural area and our power is variable to say the least. I also have
    another 1500 for my home theater system. They work very well and do exactly
    what they are supposed to. We used to have a lot of problems with failed
    components after brown/black outs and since we put in the two APC 1500s we
    have had none at all.

    Ed
     
    Ed Medlin, Sep 26, 2006
    #7
  8. You may have been premature on buying the new battery. Typical battery
    life is about 6 years.
     
    Barry Watzman, Sep 26, 2006
    #8
  9. Per Barry Watzman:
    Anybody know how the APC utility decides when to start nagging the user about
    battery replacement? I'm guessing something about voltage of the fully-charged
    battery.
     
    (PeteCresswell), Sep 26, 2006
    #9
  10. (PeteCresswell)

    Eric Parker Guest

    I'm not sure how it detects it but one that I look after started
    emailing me warnings.
    I was getting about 3 a day. I told the owner straight away and warned
    him a couple
    of more times over the next 2 weeks when it died making a whistling
    noise.
    We had to run without UPS for a few days while we got a replacement.

    So if it complains I'd swap it immediately.

    Eric
     
    Eric Parker, Sep 26, 2006
    #10
  11. (PeteCresswell)

    Leythos Guest

    typical batter life, in a residential setting, is between 2 and 5 years
    - according to APC Support technicians. I've seen batteries, new, last
    only 1 year in a setting with lots of power problems.
     
    Leythos, Sep 26, 2006
    #11
  12. (PeteCresswell), Sep 27, 2006
    #12
  13. (PeteCresswell)

    Mitch Crane Guest

    12v. That particular unit came with 2 6v batteries wired in series.
     
    Mitch Crane, Sep 27, 2006
    #13
  14. (PeteCresswell)

    DK Guest

    Mine came with a 12 v battery too.
     
    DK, Sep 27, 2006
    #14
  15. (PeteCresswell)

    Peter Finney Guest

    I had to replace the battery on my APC Backup UPS Pro 650 after about
    2.5 years. I concluded that it was running too hot - after moving the
    box to improve ventilation it is much cooler.

    Before the failure warning it was showing reduced capacity.
    Peter Finney
    Liphook
    Hampshire
    England
     
    Peter Finney, Sep 27, 2006
    #15
  16. (PeteCresswell)

    edavid3001 Guest

    I have a number of APC UPS devices in my home and at work. I started
    getting the nag message at home on my main PC. The battery lasted
    about 6 months after the nagging. However, one day the PC would not
    boot. I checked and the PSU was failed. I replaced it, and the
    second PSU made a sound and failed. I replaced with a third and
    bypassed the UPS and was back up.

    I had a router, cable modem, and such also plugged into this UPS. They
    started acting up. They would quit working, and the router kept
    loosing it's configuration.

    Ends up the problem was with the UPS and the old battery. I replaced
    the battery and all is fine again. The computer and all are back on
    this old UPS with a new APC battery.

    I could have saved some bucks if I'd of just replaced the battery when
    I was reminded to do so. While I used an APC branded battery (though
    it is 3rd party) we replace with other brands at work.

    I almost went with this Panasonic for $10 less;
    http://www.wholesalebatteries.us/replace.cfm/hurl/RBC51/UPS/APC/BE500U/LC-R127R2P1_LC-R127R2P1.htm
    But figured I'd go with APC incase something else was wrong with the
    UPS.
     
    edavid3001, Sep 27, 2006
    #16
  17. This really doesn't make a lot of sense. All of the low end APC units
    are "standby" UPS .... they don't run on batteries except during a power
    "event" ... rather, you are directly connected to the AC power line
    through a surge supressor. Thus a bad battery (regardless of how one
    defines "bad") can only cause problems when there is a power line
    "event" requiring the UPS to switch from the AC power line to the inverter.
     
    Barry Watzman, Sep 27, 2006
    #17
  18. (PeteCresswell)

    Kyle Guest

    |
    | >In article <>,
    | >says...
    | >> You may have been premature on buying the new battery. Typical
    battery
    | >> life is about 6 years.
    | >
    | >typical batter life, in a residential setting, is between 2 and 5
    years
    | >- according to APC Support technicians. I've seen batteries, new,
    last
    | >only 1 year in a setting with lots of power problems.
    |
    | I had to replace the battery on my APC Backup UPS Pro 650 after
    about
    | 2.5 years. I concluded that it was running too hot - after moving
    the
    | box to improve ventilation it is much cooler.
    |
    |

    It all depends on many mysterious factors, including the UPS's circuit
    design, but 2-3 years is a more safe estimate of longevity. I have a
    minuteman UPS that does not tolerate much battery degradation, and
    needs batteries every couple of years. In fact, recent new batteries
    for this unit lasted only 5 months, turns out one of the two 6V
    batteries exhibited a voltage dip when the load was initially applied
    to it during a power outage, triggering the UPS's circuitry to
    indicate battery failure even tho the battery voltage would nearly
    immediately return back to near normal levels under load (did some
    power resistor tests on the unit). The battery would charge up
    properly, but apparently has a manufacturing defect of some sort as
    voltage drops of 2-3 volts were observed across one of the batteries
    on application of a significant load, then output voltage returned to
    normal voltage nearly immediately.

    OTOH, I have an APC unit that is a 500 or 600 VAR unit that is about
    10 years old, and its batteries lasted 9 years before the unit "puked"
    on a power failure. I learned from this that the brand of batteries
    does make a difference and prefer Panasonic or Yuasa brand gel cell
    sealed batteries over "brand x" type gel cells sold thru retail stores
    such as Batteries Plus.

    Another factor affecting life span of the batteries is whether the UPS
    performs any self tests. I have an APC net-1000 (or some such model)
    UPS that uses 2 huge 6v batteries and it is fairly "smart", and
    performs battery load testing at some unknown interval and also during
    power up events.
     
    Kyle, Sep 27, 2006
    #18
  19. (PeteCresswell)

    edavid3001 Guest

    Yes, I understand that the cheaper ones don't use the battery unless of
    an outage, or dip. However, the power in my area is very unstable.
    The first month I had the UPS, it switched on over 100 times per the
    software counter. It's a little better now.

    I had 2 PSU's blow and other hardware instability while the bad battery
    was in place. Replace the battery, or bypass the UPS and things work
    fine. The battery was kicking out about 80V when switched on per VO
    meter. It did handle a 100W light okay. What else could it have been
    if not the battery? I still have it so I could test it if I new how.
     
    edavid3001, Sep 27, 2006
    #19
  20. (PeteCresswell)

    Kyle Guest

    | Yes, I understand that the cheaper ones don't use the battery unless
    of
    | an outage, or dip. However, the power in my area is very unstable.
    | The first month I had the UPS, it switched on over 100 times per the
    | software counter. It's a little better now.
    |
    | I had 2 PSU's blow and other hardware instability while the bad
    battery
    | was in place. Replace the battery, or bypass the UPS and things
    work
    | fine. The battery was kicking out about 80V when switched on per
    VO
    | meter. It did handle a 100W light okay. What else could it have
    been
    | if not the battery? I still have it so I could test it if I new
    how.
    |

    It stands to reason that a low input voltage to a PC power supply
    might force the switching regulator circuits to work much harder than
    normal to maintain rated outputs, causing overheating in the caps and
    thus failures, particularly cheap branded PS units with cheap
    capacitors. I've also seen cheap caps in more expensive PS units, ya
    never know what you're gonna get any more.

    As to AC power stability from the power utility, I see brief or
    momentary power outages all the time in my area, I live in a large
    midwestern US city and see power drops mostly on clear sunny days
    (iow, not weather related). Oddly, I usually hear what sounds like a
    very loud gunshot in the distance when power dropouts occur (I live
    about 1 mile from the power substation). Since I work out of my home,
    I invested in UPS protection for all critical systems, and some not so
    critical systems (hehe, my gaming rig).
     
    Kyle, Sep 27, 2006
    #20
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