Why Apple manufacturing will remain overseas

Discussion in 'Apple' started by Michelle Steiner, Jan 22, 2012.

  1. Michelle Steiner, Jan 22, 2012
    #1
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  2. Michelle Steiner

    JF Mezei Guest

    JF Mezei, Jan 22, 2012
    #2
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  3. Michelle Steiner

    bill van Guest

    (unlurking, briefly)

    She's using MTNW, same version as mine, and that URL was not broken for
    me. Perhaps there's an issue going from MTNW to Thunderbird.

    bill
     
    bill van, Jan 22, 2012
    #3
  4. Michelle Steiner

    Jeff Gaines Guest

    It is a good article. I'm a bit surprised that it had to explain the
    benefits of manufacturing in areas where labour costs are low, it's pretty
    obvious.

    America still carries out a lot of manufacturing which other countries
    have realised can be done cheaper elsewhere, not least because of
    ridiculous union demands. The unions killed most manufacturing here in the
    UK, I guess it will come to America eventually.
     
    Jeff Gaines, Jan 22, 2012
    #4
  5. C&H stopped growing sugar in Hawaii because they had to pay people
    $22/hour to tend the fields, harvest and process it. It's about
    $1-$2/hour in the Philippines.
     
    Michael Vilain, Jan 22, 2012
    #5
  6. Michelle Steiner

    Tom Stiller Guest

    I noticed the article failed to mention Jobs observation that the US
    could not supply the 30,000 manufacturing engineers required to support
    the 700,000 assembly line workers.
     
    Tom Stiller, Jan 22, 2012
    #6
  7. Michelle Steiner

    Alan Browne Guest

    I saw the same article. It comes down to notions of labor management
    that are more akin to a semi-volunteer army of workers and managers.
    "Mobilization" is king.
     
    Alan Browne, Jan 22, 2012
    #7
  8. Michelle Steiner

    Alan Browne Guest

    That's not the key benefit.
     
    Alan Browne, Jan 22, 2012
    #8
  9. Michelle Steiner

    Tim McNamara Guest

    Weird, her URL worked correctly for me in MT-NewWatcher. Are you sure
    it's Michelle's newsreader or is it perhaps yours?
    The other way around: enclosing the URL in angle brackets: <URL> will
    prevent multi-line URLs from breaking in most (but not all) newsreaders.
    Newsreaders that insert a newline when wrapping flowed text will break
    multiline URLs for the person reading the post (newsreaders that don't
    properly handle flowed text when posting will also break them).
     
    Tim McNamara, Jan 22, 2012
    #9
  10. Michelle Steiner

    Alan Browne Guest

    Usually my client works with line broken links - but not Michelle's.
    Her news client inserted a break. No excuse for thunderbird - it
    usually handles that.
     
    Alan Browne, Jan 22, 2012
    #10
  11. Michelle Steiner

    Tim McNamara Guest

    One of the points was that the primary reasons for manufacturing in
    China don't really include labor costs.

    America has shifted its educational priorities through "No Child Left
    Behind." The assumption is now that every American child will go to
    college and become an executive, which means that high school is no
    longer designed to give graduates sufficient skills to earn a decent
    living. The curriculum is geared towards college preparation (never
    mind that about half of the population is really not college material,
    which means that college curricula must be dumbed down to allow those
    students to graduate) rather than life skill development. We have
    gutted public vocational-technical schools and have no apprenticeship
    programs to teach vocations.

    The end result is that we will have a population trained to do menial
    labor and as executives, with nothing in the middle.

    One of the best things we could do for this nation is to require a class
    in formal logic in high school. Teaching people how to think logically
    would have gigantic payoffs at every level of the economy.
    Here in the US unions are scapegoated especially by right wingers but
    they are not the underlying cause of killing manufacturing. The hatred
    that has been fomented against unions here is about power and who has
    it. Conservatism now hates anyone but the rich having power and attacks
    anything that stands in their way. Unions were the primary bulwark
    against the abuses of power and wealth that were rampant prior to a
    certain Thursday in 1929. The Republicans have been trying to roll
    America back to October 23, 1929 for decades. Ah, the good old days!

    Indeed the events leading up to the Great Recession demonstrate the lie
    of the good old days. The parallels are quite striking including the
    very same sets of erroneous beliefs and ill-advised financial practices
    (aided and abetted by the miraculous efficiencies of technology to
    replicate mistakes millions of times before a human can notice).

    Unrestrained capitalism concentrates power and wealth in the hands of a
    very few and consigns the majority to poverty, as we have seen
    developing inexorably in the US since the "Reagan Revolution." The
    ironic thing is that this is presented as "patriotic" even though the
    original patriots fought against the concentration of power and wealth
    in the hands of a few (in that case a hereditary monarchy). Unions
    stood in the way of the process of beggaring the majority, but the
    concerted union-busting efforts of the Reagan Administration combined
    with globalization effectively removed the protection of unions from all
    but a handful of Americans.
     
    Tim McNamara, Jan 22, 2012
    #11
  12. Many defenders of US outsourcing manufacturing already blame the unions.
    Yet, some Japanese (and, I think, some European) auto manufacturers have
    built plants here in the USA because it is cheaper than building them
    elsewhere.
     
    Michelle Steiner, Jan 22, 2012
    #12
  13. Michelle Steiner

    Tim McNamara Guest

    Apples and sugar cane are different. The article underscored that most
    of the factors involved in manufacturing high-tech products are not
    about cost of labor. Sugar cane harvesting is very low tech and labor
    cost is a much more significant portion of the costs of production.
     
    Tim McNamara, Jan 22, 2012
    #13

  14. Your news client breaks your URLs.

    (I checked the source code of the message and it is split there).[/QUOTE]

    Your news client is the problem; even with the URL broken into two or more
    lines, a proper news client can read the URL just fine if it is enclosed in
    angle brackets, as I did.

    But for people who have broken new readers like yours, I included a tinyURL.
     
    Michelle Steiner, Jan 22, 2012
    #14
  15. Any decent news reader won't mind. Mine certainly didn't. One click, and
    I was viewing the page.[/QUOTE]

    Don't you understand that nothing is the fault of Mezei or of any software
    that he chooses to use? It's always someone else's fault. Just like with
    Peter in the iPad and iPhone newsgroups.
     
    Michelle Steiner, Jan 22, 2012
    #15
  16. Michelle Steiner

    Kurt Ullman Guest

    But a large part of that is a function of dollar/home currency issues.
    Especially if they want to sell them here. Which is yet another rather
    bothersome tangent to get off on.
     
    Kurt Ullman, Jan 22, 2012
    #16
  17. One also has to ask the question of whether we want to be involved in a
    "race to the bottom", lowering wages in the US to match those in the
    third world. People who advocate this seem to forget that these low wage
    people will never be able to purchase all the goods manufactured.
     
    David Fritzinger, Jan 22, 2012
    #17
  18. Michelle Steiner

    Howard Guest

    Clearly you didn't read the article. Cheap labour is nothing to do with
    it.

    The point the article makes well is that labour costs are not the issue.
    The issue is labour and engineers availability, the ability to develop
    huge factories quickly and the logistics of having large scale
    industrial parks where materials and parts are nearby.

    Developed western countries like the US are burdened with planning laws,
    labour laws, comfortable workers.

    Howard
     
    Howard, Jan 22, 2012
    #18
  19. Michelle Steiner

    Howard Guest

    You just don't read ... labour costs are NOT the issue here with Apple.
    Read the article.


    H
     
    Howard, Jan 22, 2012
    #19
  20. Michelle Steiner

    Howard Guest

    It does.

    H
     
    Howard, Jan 22, 2012
    #20
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